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Turk
2005-04-10, 19:26
Okay folks I am going to run this one by you to see what you think.
It started as a joke, it became a mildly amusing conversation, and developed into a genuine idea.

To start allow me to state the problem to be solved.

"How do you stop a moose from tripping over/ walking into/ walking through your hammock/ hammock lines in the middle of the night?"

Here is what we came up with:
http://www.geocities.com/roleplayingt2t/moosesetup.JPG

The idea is pretty simple. I get some lightweight rope, about 100ft should do it. As thin as possible and with a breaking strength of at least 1500 lbs. (enough that a moose can put a majority of its bodyweight against without breaking. enough to make a moose decide to change the direction they are walking in)

When we hammock camp, we tie off a perimeter with this rope that encompasses the hammocks and the guy out lines.

So .. any thoughts on this one?
Think this will work?
Where can I find good thin rope as light as possible to accomplish this?
And lastly, any improvements or modifications I should consider?

Lone Wolf
2005-04-10, 21:38
Claymores. Well placed.

Iceman
2005-04-10, 21:43
How about a very small radio, left playing all night a few yards off, would keep a moose and maybe a bear away? Sure it may annoy the campers, until asleep, but might keep your animals at bay.

Just Jeff
2005-04-10, 22:09
Trunk monkey in your pack. Guess that would be a pack monkey.

GregH
2005-04-10, 22:34
I was going to suggest Kelty Triptease but their website says the breaking strength is only 188 lb. The moose probably wouldn't even feel it on his way to stomping your hammock.

Turk
2005-04-11, 00:35
I was going to suggest Kelty Triptease but their website says the breaking strength is only 188 lb. The moose probably wouldn't even feel it on his way to stomping your hammock.

Ya you hit it right on the nose.
I need something very strong. Strong enough that a moose can bump into it and decide to turn left or right. I don't want to keep moose away. I just dont want them walking through my hammock lines which I don't think they would even notice. That wouldn't be a pleasant way to wake up.

Can't say as id blame him though. In LSSP canoe portages are not man made. They simply follow the moose trails. People are the intruders. They walk along their trails and eat vegetation within reach as they go.

In most cases the underbrush is so thick, we are forced to make camps within 3ft of the actual moose trail. Often times even making camp on both sides eg: cookfire on one side, shelter on other.

My moose perimiter set-up would only be for times where my hammock is in very close proximity to the moose trail 10ft or less. The idea being that if I can keep the trail clear of any obstacle of mine, then the moose-line should "steer" the moose from getting too curious about my hammock.

least thats the theory.

Rage in a Cage
2005-04-11, 00:42
I don't believe it will stop a moose but it may get his attention. The downfall is you would have to carry a long rope. I mean if you don't get the rope far enough away from your hammock you are just going to cause him to loose his balance and guess where he is going to land? RIP Turk, The victim of a loose moose noose. :bawling:

KLeth
2005-04-11, 02:16
Bring a canine or just some droppings from a carnivore and I don't think the rope has to be very tough :fisheye:

I saw that it's possible to get a intrusion detector :
http://www.actiongear.com/cgi-bin/tame.exe/agcatalog/level4s.tam?xax=24105&M5COPY%2Ectx=7391&M5%2Ectx=7391&M2%5FDESC%2Ectx=Security%20Equipment%2D%20Metal%20 Scanners&level3%2Ectx=results%2Etam&query%2Ectx=tripwire&backto=%2Fagcatalog%2Fresults%2Etam

It's also very easy to make your own electric, tripwire activated intrusion alarm.
Refer to USFM TM31-210 & FM5-31 :elefant: Watch out for hands, eyes ect.

Or mix a few things like a mousetraps, flashbulbs, battry, wire, nails and a few meters of tripwire/cord. If I remember corectly moose almost always run heads up - This means that the wire/rope might be placed best in a height of app. 200cm to be triggered by its head, shoulders or antlers. :angel:

Rage in a Cage
2005-04-11, 03:19
Bring a canine or just some droppings from a carnivore and I don't think the rope has to be very tough :fisheye:

I saw that it's possible to get a intrusion detector :
http://www.actiongear.com/cgi-bin/tame.exe/agcatalog/level4s.tam?xax=24105&M5COPY%2Ectx=7391&M5%2Ectx=7391&M2%5FDESC%2Ectx=Security%20Equipment%2D%20Metal%20 Scanners&level3%2Ectx=results%2Etam&query%2Ectx=tripwire&backto=%2Fagcatalog%2Fresults%2Etam

It's also very easy to make your own electric, tripwire activated intrusion alarm.
Refer to USFM TM31-210 & FM5-31 :elefant: Watch out for hands, eyes ect.

Or mix a few things like a mousetraps, flashbulbs, battry, wire, nails and a few meters of tripwire/cord. If I remember corectly moose almost always run heads up - This means that the wire/rope might be placed best in a height of app. 200cm to be triggered by its head, shoulders or antlers. :angel:
Heck you might as well get the TM 31-210 and mix a little munitions in with your electric tripwire activated intrusion alarm. You'll have moose burgers for the rest of your trip. :biggrin:

KLeth
2005-04-11, 05:04
:eating: Mooseburgers sounds real :eating: tasty :biggrin:

Lanthar
2005-04-11, 08:16
1/4" 12 Strand Spectra (http://www.pelicanrope.com/spectra.htm)

Lanthar
2005-04-11, 08:20
Thoudh, 3/16" POLY-DAC (http://www.machovec.com/rope/poly_dac.htm) i sprobably more economical

Turk
2005-04-12, 00:28
Lanthar you are the man!

That spectra line is PERFECT for the task.

Super light, super thin. Carrying a 100ft coil is only going to add 1.6 lbs
and it floats on water. Great find! thanks.

Iceman
2005-04-12, 03:03
Turk, let us know how much this stuff ends up costing you, thanks. Sounds like pretty cool stuff.

Lanthar
2005-04-12, 10:46
I've considered the Spectra for a homemade hammock project I'm thinking of...

PKH
2005-04-12, 19:01
I once had a moose step right over me when I was laying in my bivy. This was in Fundy National Park in New Brunswick. I had a 8 by 5 tarp pitched at the head end with guy lines stretched all over the place. The damned moose tip toed right through them all without tripping once and then straddled me and my bivy. I will always remember the awful feeling of waiting for one of those montrous hoofs to come down on my stomach.

The only fool proof way to stay out of moose country, and for me, that's not an option.

Cheers,

PKH

dougmeredith
2005-04-13, 09:24
I once had a moose step right over me when I was laying in my bivy. This was in Fundy National Park in New Brunswick.

I'm taking my six year old son camping in Fundy this weekend. I will have to tell him your story. He will get a kick out of it.

Doug

CanoeBlue
2005-04-13, 19:38
PKH - I think that I would also be laying there thinking "OK Moose - don't pee - OK? P-L-E-A-S-E don't pee" :biggrin:

PKH
2005-04-14, 09:03
Well yeah, that would have been slightly irritating. But I was just a little more concerned about 800 to 1000 lbs right in the solar plexus. :)

Cheers,

PKH

KeyMeKoe
2005-04-29, 15:31
Turk was wondering if you had any familiarity with White Lake, off Highway 17 near Pukaskwa. I was thinking of taking a sailing kayak trip there and was looking for a review.
KeyMeKoe

Iceman
2005-12-10, 11:03
Ya you hit it right on the nose.
I need something very strong. Strong enough that a moose can bump into it and decide to turn left or right. I don't want to keep moose away. I just dont want them walking through my hammock lines which I don't think they would even notice. That wouldn't be a pleasant way to wake up.

Can't say as id blame him though. In LSSP canoe portages are not man made. They simply follow the moose trails. People are the intruders. They walk along their trails and eat vegetation within reach as they go.

In most cases the underbrush is so thick, we are forced to make camps within 3ft of the actual moose trail. Often times even making camp on both sides eg: cookfire on one side, shelter on other.

My moose perimiter set-up would only be for times where my hammock is in very close proximity to the moose trail 10ft or less. The idea being that if I can keep the trail clear of any obstacle of mine, then the moose-line should "steer" the moose from getting too curious about my hammock.

least thats the theory.

Here you go Turk, Merry Christmas;

http://www.waterstrider.com/bear-repellent-portable-electric-fence.htm

Mutinousdoug
2005-12-10, 17:58
Here you go Turk, Merry Christmas;

http://www.waterstrider.com/bear-repellent-portable-electric-fence.htm

That fence looks to be a little heavy for backpacking, but alot of fun on a big campout.
Kinda ties in with the stun gun thread.

Iceman
2005-12-10, 19:12
Yup, sort of like the last Tie I received, not exactly the one I wanted...so it goes with this gift, it's the thought that counted...Happy hiking. Maybe we can get someone to lighten this down a bit? Any volunteer/s?

Mutinousdoug
2005-12-10, 22:57
... Maybe we can get someone to lighten this down a bit? Any volunteer/s?

I'm thinking 500 ft of fence wire is a little extravagant, but maybe in brown bear country I'd go three times around my tent, just to be sure. That would be about 120 ft of wire.
Actually, I'd like to see the effect it has on a bear before I think about downsizing it. Or trusting my sleep to it. How does it work in the rain?
The trouble with stock fence is any wet twig falling on the wire to the ground shorts out the whole perimeter, and bears live in those tag alders on Kodiak island, don't they?

dropkick
2005-12-11, 01:04
Just a thought, and don't know if it would work, but what if you strung fishing line around your campsite and hooked your bearbell, pots, etc. to it?
Would the sound deter a moose?
What if you hung the fishing line about 7 foot up and hooked your clothes on it to air out and flap in the breeze? Would you do 2 things at once, or watch the moose walk off with your pants dangling from its' antlers?

Kea
2005-12-11, 23:45
A log chain. Strong, with high tensile strength. You can attach any number of deterrants to it.

Heavy though :(

This whole thread reminds me of the story that one of my Canadian buddies tells about insurance adjusters in Toronto trying to take down a claim in one of the Eastern Provinces. Seems that they had infact erected a 10 foot fence for the parking compund, to prevent the Elk and Moose from wreaking havoc with the cars. The elk just leapt it in one bound and kept going, across the roofs of the cars, across the compound, where they leapt the 10 foot fence on the other side. I guess the adjuster was having trouble relating to it. Hee hee.

Gramps
2005-12-14, 21:26
"How do you stop a moose from..." Oh, my. While I was surveying up north, a moose derailed a narrow-gauge locomotive, then walked away. Another one bent the outboard engine nacelle on a 707... Light-weight answer? Hang your hammock about twenty feet up.

Turk
2005-12-15, 20:24
Light-weight answer? Hang your hammock about twenty feet up.

I tried that one in my thread "high hammock pitch". Testing didn't go well.
I was going for a 9ft hammock pitch, but couldn't pull it off without alot
of weight and expense. I tried pulley system, just ropes, and one pulley with
one rock climbing ascender. The results were extremely time consuming,
and not very feasable. I haven't given up completely yet on it. It is just
on the back burner.

What I HAVE found to be working great is 1/8" Spectra cord that I believe
Lanthar or Sgathak first introduced me to. I have been carrying 80ft of
the stuff and it is very light weight for its high breaking strength.

"Noise makers" are not very effective deterrants for moose. A bull moose
can weigh in over a tonne and has no natural predator. They tend to
"stroll" through the forest completely oblivious of small trees and underbrush.
However, they can just as readily be surprisingly stealthy when they catch
an unfamiliar scent eg: humans.

Turk
2005-12-15, 20:41
Here you go Turk, Merry Christmas;

http://www.waterstrider.com/bear-repellent-portable-electric-fence.htm


Thanks man. Hey, .. are there any claymores left over from Vietnam? I am
sure the military guys here could show me how to rig up the trip wires to
detonate them. Might go well with that fencing. Not quite sure how I would
obtain some though here in Canada.
Well .. I suppose I could take a trip down to Detroit or maybe Colorado and
buy em from kids in the school yard ;) Whats the exchange rate on
Bubble gum for Ammo anyways? :biggrin:

Would be a pretty neat setup with that fencing. Could probablly market
that well in a Walmart or Canadian Tire store:

"Enjoy wildlife with the whole family. Frag a squirrel today!
Show those woodland creatures who's boss. Sleep easier
knowing ... you got the bomb! - Each sold separately.
Parental supervision recommended. Return for refund if
not completely satisfied."

Iceman
2005-12-16, 01:00
How about this, you bring the battery zapper device, forget the fencing, but bring a single wire which you hang at about 6 feet off the ground, the moose comes in and "zap", he gets the zoinking :elefant: and "hopefully" stampedes away in the safe direction? This set up can't weigh much more than a claymore or two...

:idea: I'm thinking a strategically placed fecal pile upwind of your camp, and a radio blaring into the night might be your best bet. I know it would keep me away...