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KLeth
2007-05-29, 08:41
We have a new hiking companion
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/245/517582290_7a3559c386.jpg
Any recommendations on what to train a trail dog to ? Besides the usual disciplines.
- We do not need to learn him to sleep in a hammock since we are ground dwellers :ahhhhh:
He is a "Finnish Lapphund" which is a dog bred for herding reinddeer.

dropkick
2007-05-30, 01:13
Nice looking dog. Enjoy him.

The most important command for a trail dog is "here", but that's just part of the normal commands.

You could try teaching him to obey whistle commands, as the whistle can be heard over a longer distance and also over the noise of streams or any other interference. (I've started this with my dog).

You might also think of training him to a pack, so that he can carry his own food and gear
I haven't actually done this with my dog, but I know people who have.

I purposely took my dog around cattle, horses, and deer when she was young and when she started to chase (actually she only tried with the deer) I disciplined her harshly so as to make a serious impression. She now looks but doesn't chase (I've seen her startle deer when she thought she was alone and not chase - so it isn't just when I'm there).
This is important to me not only because I wouldn't like her doing it, it is also a shooting offense in Montana, and anyone seeing her chasing cattle or game could legally shoot her.


Had a friend who wished he'd taught his dog "go away" after it made a bear angry and then brought it back to him.

GGS
2007-05-30, 01:21
I taught my lab to hike with a pack. She carries our water, her bed mat, her food and dish, and any misc doggie stuff - leash, collar, tether rope for campsites, and fly spray for her ears. A pack should weigh no more than 25% of the dog's weight. I adjust my lab's pack to be around 10% of her weight.

Maintain a close perimeter - don't wander off too far! This can be taught in two ways, calling her when she wanders "out of range" and giving her a treat when she returns, and playing "hide and seek". She gets too far ahead, isn't watching, distracted by a squirrel or whatever, hide. Duck behind a tree, hide in tall grass, I've even turned and sprinted the opposite way for some distance and hid a hundred yards off trail. Eventually Pooch looks up, realizes you aren't behind her and she's in those spooky woods all alone, and comes looking for you. The greater Pooch's panic the more effective the lesson. Eventually Pooch will scent you out, lots of praise and treats, continue hiking, watch for next opportunity to "hide". Do this a few times and Pooch will be checking constantly to see if you're following. I do both of these tricks often on every hike and Cozy (my black lab) really maintains a tight perimeter around me now.

Recall. And I don't mean eventually returning to you after much pleading, I mean Come NOW when called, even when in hot pursuit of Mr. Chipmunk. Because as we humans know, the woods are also home to Ms. Skunk, Mr. Porcupine, Baby Bear (who will almost certainly run to the protection of Mama Bear), and Mr. and Mrs. Deer. Recall under distractions is tough to teach. Cozy wears an electronic collar which I use only in those moments when distraction proves too much to bear.

lucky luke
2007-05-30, 13:06
... Cozy wears an electronic collar which I use only in those moments when distraction proves too much to bear.

is that how you are? you torture your friends?

you know, there is a humane way to teach your dog. i have a trained search and rescue dog, and he never even got hit with a hand or a newspaper or anything else. sounds to me like you need a little bit more love in your life.

wearing the collar yourself and shocking yourself, just for a try, will probably cure your desire to hit your "cozy". give it a honest try. those things hurt like hell. and dont use a cheap excuse like "yeah, but she has fur..."

i think, if your dog hunts its your fault, because its her nature and you wont let her. if the gun fires its not the guns fault, is it? so its your responsibility to make sure she does not get a chance to hunt. you MUST be faster than her discovering whatever there is. and then its your job to be a better distraction than whatever is out there. if you don´t its your fault and you get the hit, because you were not watching out good enough... thats the way i teach, and not just dogs. thats why i never will hit any other creature other than in selfdefense. i shocked myself once to find out. i will not need this reminder a second time.

happy powerless trails for cozy,
greets
lucky luke

Take-a-knee
2007-05-30, 13:44
Lucy Luke, just in case no one has yet told you today what an idiot you are, let me be the first.

Bear
2007-05-30, 15:06
I work with someone that bought a shock collar to train his lab. He wanted to test it on himself so he set it about midway and held it in his hand and got a mild shock. He then placed it around his neck and when he hit the button, he hit the floor. Needless to say his wife and son hit the floor laughing. He still used it to train his dog and the dog has survived.

Now for my personal experience, we used to have a neighbor that had a German Shepard that was let outside every morning at 4AM. He liked to let everyone know he was outside, especially us since our bedroom window was close to her back door, by barking at absolutely nothing and waking us up each morning. Finally, after many talks with her and complaints to the police, we purchased a shock collar and she placed it on her dog and we had the controlls. It sure shut him up quick and saved his life because a few more complaints to the police and he would have been history.

If that sounds cruel to you it is because you were not the one being awakened each and every morning at 4AM to roof roof roof!

BigJohn
2007-05-30, 15:18
A dog’s chase reflex is automatic and evolutionary. There is not much that you can do to prevent your pet from wanting to chase other animals. Unfortunately a firm hand is sometimes the only way to reason with your dog. I’m not condoning wanton abuse. When the safety of your own person and your pet is at risk however I believe corrective action is certainly warranted. Sometimes a little reassurance, such as an electric collar, is necessary. My two cents.

TeeDee
2007-05-30, 18:41
Lucy Luke, just in case no one has yet told you today what an idiot you are, let me be the first.

Take-a-knee - now don't be shy. Really. You shouldn't be shy about speaking your mind. Just come right out and say what's on the top of your head. :ahhhhh: :biggrin:

deadeye
2007-05-30, 20:15
I love dogs, but I'm not a big fan of dogs on the trail, although it's probably more accurate to say I'm not a big fan of the dogs' owners. Buttt... I realize I'm in the minority,so here's my 2 cents:

1)Teach the dog to wait before going into water, so he doesn't foul it for humans

2)Don't assume others will like having your dog around. Man, I hate hearing "It's OK, he's friendly!" especially after a dog pisses on my pack or sleeping bag, or licks my snack bar, etc. My usual response is "I'm not!"

Jeez, the list goes on. I have met some very nice dogs on the trail, the well-trained ones are a joy to have around, and it's usually a reflection on the owner. Odds are, if the dog's not well-behaved, I don't want to get to know the owner, either.

Did I get up on the wrong side today, or what?:argh:

Iceman
2007-05-31, 00:09
...I'm not a big fan of dogs...especially after a dog ....licks my snack bar...:

Is that what you call yours?
I don't know, I have only had dogs sniff my snack bar...I might get to liking the licking... :biggrin:

I volunteered to get tased for the whole five seconds with one of our tasers, and let me tell you what, they hurt like a motherf#&$er. But, after the 50K volts, no pain, pain all gone, Iceman is now a good boy. An occassional zap with the collar shocker, will surely be a useful training device. I would image a dog learns real quick what the Master doesn't want him doing. (IE: Barking, etc...) I would imagine that chasing deer or whatever may not work, because of the instinctual chase mode built into dogs...might be worth the try...

I would encourage the owner of all shock collars to take a full blast themselves with the device before zapping "sparky" so that they know what they are actually delivering to the mutt.

We spank in our home.....Lucky Like, it's called tough love, and many folks around the world have been practicing a bit of it in their homes for a long time... Not sure if calling a bit of strong handed discipline "torture" is quite appropriate. On the other hand, if some dipstick kept zapping the dog for no apparent reason, after the device clearly was not working to disrupt and quell bad behavior, I would be the first to call this abusive.

Rhino-lfl
2007-05-31, 09:00
1. Teach him to distill alcohol
2. Teach him to carry your gear
3. Teach him to cook
4. Teach him to call dominos or order chinese
5. Teach him to run into the liquor store and get your beer
6. Teach him to clean the house
7. Teach him to speak mexican
8. Teach him how to PWN in Halo
9. Teach him gun repair
10. Teach him how to get super hotty hot hot chicks to have the nookie with you

GGS
2007-05-31, 15:00
is that how you are? you torture your friends? you know, there is a humane way to teach your dog.

happy powerless trails for cozy,
greets
lucky luke

Lucky Luke, I don't "teach" my dog with an electronic collar. I teach using methods you are probably familiar with - praise, treats, love, time, patience, and repetition. The collar is simply an "invisible leash", a method of maintaining control in the field to help ensure that the dog doesn't get into trouble or do anything dangerous.

Based on this post and some other posts I see perhaps it would be helpful if I de-mystify what a training collar is. I use an _electronic training collar_, not a shock collar. A shock collar is just that - a high powered zapping device to punish a dog. There is no way to lower the stimulus. It is extremely painful, and it is cruel and unnecessary. Shock collars were the "first generation" electronic collars made years ago and are no longer available.

An _Electronic training collar_ is a training device that offers tone stimulus as well as many levels of electric stimulus. The more levels the better, not because you want some super high level, but because you want a smooth gradient of choices starting from an imperceptible level - a level that the dog cannot feel. The purpose of the collar is not to punish the dog, it is to distract the dog from an undesired behavior so that we can redirect it towared the desired behavior. And we're looking for the lowest level of stimulation that accomplishes that. (You can use the tone a couple of different ways, as a warning or even as a reward or command in itself. I use the tone as the recall command, ie. [tone] "Cozy, Come!" Sometimes she can't hear my voice but she can hear the collar tone and can respond to that.)

Next step, finding the correct stimulation level. Remember we're looking for the lowest stimulation level that has a distracting effect. No, you DON'T "put it on the middle setting" and put it on dog/yourself and see what happens! (OK if you want to be a dumbass and do it to yourself and film it and put your stupid ass reaction on Youtube go ahead but please DON'T do it to your dog!) Always start with the LOWEST possible setting and observe the reaction. For my part, I strapped the collar to my arm and tested it. At level 1 I could not feel a thing. Level 2, nothing. Level 3, nothing. (I had to pause to make sure the collar was turned on.) Level 4, I felt a perceptible tingle. Level 5, tingle was stronger. Level 6 it was a pretty good poke, like scuffing wool socks across carpet on a dry winter day and touching something metal. Not pleasant, but not a "torture shock" either. Just a good poke.

Ok now all that's fine and dandy but we're not concerned with us - we're concerned with how the dog reacts. So I put the collar on Cozy, have her lie down, stay, and hold up a treat. She watches the treat intensely, and with Level 1 I press the button. Nothing. No reaction. No reaction to level 2 or 3 either. At level 4 I see a ear twitch. Eyes still on treat and NO VOCALIZATION (There should never be vocalizaion, that means the level of stimulation is too high!), no other reaction, just an ear twitch.

That's my starting level. For the record, almost all of the corrections I have applied to Cozy have been at Level 4, occasionally in a high distraction environment I've had to ramp up to Level 5 to distract her. I have the alternative correction button programmed at Level 6 for emergencies and have never used it. My collar has 20 levels and I have never used it above 6 - the highest level I tested on myself. As to frequency of use, we just came back from 3 days in the backcountry where I never had to correct. It is there as a just-in-case. And intelligent minds should be able to deduce from this that I am NOT torturing my dog. ;-)

BigJohn
2007-05-31, 15:55
Whoa! total misconception. I see, so the electrical collar is just used for classical conditioning. Never used one so wouldn't know. Good info to know though.

lucky luke
2007-05-31, 16:07
Lucy Luke, just in case no one has yet told you today what an idiot you are, let me be the first.

thank you very much,
i´ll happily take a knee up my ass.
have a nice day too,
lucky luke

lucky luke
2007-05-31, 17:02
hi,

well, thanks for the explanation.

however i still despise inflicting pain on other beeings. and i still think it´s the owners fault if the dog hunts. i used to work with the command "down" as an emergency brake. it worked perfect, but with some dogs it meant practising daily. my setter, which was a trained and certified hunting dog would go down instantly on whistling 1000 feet away chasing a deer. but i tell you, he was so f* stubborn and we really had to fight it out every single day. the only way to keep him at bay was to work him daily. the next one was much easier to train because of his mentality. i admit mine had changed a bit too. and the softer i got the easier i could teach my dogs. mister meany stays on the trail all the time, and when he gets excited he gets distracted before something happens. i can distinguish by his behaviour if a person is ahead or something small like bird or squirrel or something big like deer. and i can keep him without a leash in an area of about 30 feet around me while he is still watching the deer. and i did get him down last time he started to run about 150 feet away. but he´s still young, only turning 2 now. his down is not a correct down with head between his paws, stretched out flat. he lies comfortably, but honestly i don´t care. he is controllable all the time, i can stop him before a road and my biggest fear a fence he might not see. ( i had to revise the opinion too lately. he definitely can smell the fence and knows its there) i can also stop him from jumping up at people which he will do if someone encourages him. i have never had to hit him, not even a yelled word yet. i know you can, everybody can, control his dog without pysical violence. unfortunately we all are too lazy sometimes, hung up in thoughts, to watch the world around us. and i catch myself on the often used trails and tracks not watching my dog properly. i am very lucky he is right by my side all the time i do not watch out. but if he was not i would certainly not blame it on him but on my ignorance. he deserves no punishment for my faults.
and one more reason. he only wears a collar when we´re working. i´ld be too lazy to get his electrocuting trainig device all the time, or haul it along just in case we might go for a short walk. we´re out 3-5 times a days and live, a rare thing in germany, right in the woods. he´s never on a leash around the house with all doors open. he grew up in the woods and with a lot of practise easily adjusted to things like how far away can i go, stop in front of road, etc. city walks are very exciting for him and very exhausing for me. so after a while he usually goes on the leash so i don´t have to watch and correct him all the time. but i would never think about an electronic collar. ok. enough of that. i hope you dont have to use it in the future.

happy trails
lucky luke

Take-a-knee
2007-05-31, 17:15
You are most welcome Luke. In Western Civilization, the guiding principal was, for many generations, Decartes' "Cogito ergo sum", (I think therefore, I am). Your de facto motto is, "I feel, therefore, I'm superior". We were placed on this earth by a loving God. Mankind chose to abandon God's plan eons ago, as such we are all corrupt to the core. There is yet a small, still voice in all of us that knows there is a right and a wrong in most human endeavors. Those of us who are honest know we seldom measure up to that ingrained yardstick. We know that we need something beyond ourselves to guide and sustain us. Sometimes being selfish means not sharing your means with those in need, sometimes being a self-centered bastard means that you choose to be gutless and not provide loving discipline to a part of God's Creation placed in your charge. Iconoclasts like yourself dash centuries of learning and knowledge to the ground, you storm the walls of the Bastille, thinking you will bring a new dawn. After a few sunsets it will look a lot more like Darfur than Paradise when you have your way.

dropkick
2007-05-31, 18:14
Everybody...
Calm, Calm, Calm


........well it works on my dog when she gets over excited.

rbd
2007-05-31, 19:27
That's a real nice dog. The first one's I saw was in about 1968 when I was backpacking in the Saariselka area of Lapland in the fall. Three or four rain-deer herders came by the hut & sauna with their dogs. They were looking for the herd so as to brand and ear-notch the yearlings while still with their mothers. I still remenber how one dog made his bed... turning round & round in a circle (like our Norwegean Elkhounds), but the Finnish Dog also removed stones from the bedding area while turning around. Impressive to this day. I think you made an excellent choice. Good luck to you and your new dog.

KLeth
2007-06-01, 02:08
Thank you for your advice and best whishes, but we might want to close the discussion here :angel:

He is a darn fast learner and already 90% house clean, but he has a strong will and can be a handfull when he is over excited, but we now know that we can cool him down by ignoring him (turning the back towards the dog) or distracting him by sweettalking an imaginary ball of fluff :biggrin:

We need to get him play-dates with older dogs, so they can teach him humility since he is so much an ALPHA dog.
Yesterday he met a 100lb Canadian Golden Retriever, it got his respect in one "Wrruff".

Iceman
2007-06-01, 10:37
Kleth, a very exciting time for you for sure.

We are nearing the end for my pooch here, as he is approaching 18years. He has never had good trail manners, so we just took him to areas where he didn't get in too much trouble. We even had him out camping this last weekend. Ours has very bad cataracks now, and can't hear too well, so we put a bright yellow vest on him, and a goofy little strobe light on his collar, so we can keep track of him around camp until dusk. He did get lost a few years back, only for a few minutes, he lost scent of us at camp, and in thick brush barked out irregularily, I looked pretty rediculous hurlting bushes to find him.

These dogs sure weave themselves into your soul. I will be a hopless wreck when he is gone. We make darn sure to include him in almost everything we do over the years, especially these last few years as we saw his invincibility diminishing.

We found ours at a shelter, cowering in the back of a kennel, where four other larger dogs had obviously been putting the hurt on him. We waited a week to go back to get him, and found him gone from that specific locker. Staff at the shelter whispered that they had "re-admitted" him to avoid putting him down. We said we were here to take him home! they replied, "oh, what a lucky dog!" And hence his name was born, Lucky!

Lucky is a champion of barking at other dogs when in traffic, sniffing other dogs and people in embarrassing situations, and sneaking off with your dinner if you set it down on a low table. We wouldn't have it any other way.

Bear
2007-06-01, 11:04
Lucky Luke,
Out of curiosity, how would you have handled my situation of a neighbors barking dog disturbing you? Not just in the morning but at dfferent times of the day also.:banghead: :mad2:

Rhino-lfl
2007-06-01, 14:46
... We were placed on this earth by a loving God. ...

LOL if he was so loving, he would not have placed us here with a flapjack like you.


That was just meant to breaks things up by the way ... figured you needed it explained.

Ermm ... that means a joke.

joke /dʒoʊk/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[johk] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun, verb, joked, jok·ing.
–noun 1. something said or done to provoke laughter or cause amusement, as a witticism, a short and amusing anecdote, or a prankish act: He tells very funny jokes. She played a joke on him.
2. something that is amusing or ridiculous, esp. because of being ludicrously inadequate or a sham; a thing, situation, or person laughed at rather than taken seriously; farce: Their pretense of generosity is a joke. An officer with no ability to command is a joke.
3. a matter that need not be taken very seriously; trifling matter: The loss was no joke.
4. something that does not present the expected challenge; something very easy: The test was a joke for the whole class.
5. practical joke.
–verb (used without object) 6. to speak or act in a playful or merry way: He was always joking with us.
7. to say something in fun or teasing rather than in earnest; be facetious: He didn't really mean it, he was only joking.

GGS
2007-06-01, 17:35
Lucky Luke,
Out of curiosity, how would you have handled my situation of a neighbors barking dog disturbing you? Not just in the morning but at dfferent times of the day also.:banghead: :mad2:

Bear, if I may, I'd like to take a shot at answering this. I think I see the point Lucky Luke was trying to make.

Personally, I think you did what you had to. In fact I think you went above and beyond the call of duty by offering to buy an electronic collar for your neighbor's dog. Those things aren't cheap. Kudus to you for your willingness to find a win-win situation.

The truth here is your neighbor has neglected their duty of training their dog. Because of that now YOU have to do that duty in order to get some peace and quiet in your life.

Let's analyze this from a dog trainer perspective.

The dog is being let outside at 4am. I assume to go to the bathroom.
The simplest solution would be to simply call the dog back in after it has relieved itself, or at least as soon as the barking begins. All it takes is the owner (your neighbor) being thoughtful towards others and being proactive with a dog that likes to bark.

The second assumption is this barking goes on for a while. Which means the dog is outside by itself for a while. Perhaps your neighbor just goes back to bed or leaves the dog outside during the day while she is off to work. The main reason for barking problems in dogs is boredom. A barren backyard is not enough to entertain a high energy dog like a german shepherd, and when they're bored they'll resort to destructive behaviours like barking and digging to entertain themselves. Leaving the dog _inside_ during the day is a first step. There's lots of ways to do this without the dog being destructive, I won't list the hows here. Next, give the dog challenging entertainment opportunities when you are home. Take the dog for a walk. Have a 10 minute training session twice a day. Have a play session. Involve the dog in your life as much as possible - spend time in the backyard with the dog, take the dog with you on short trips (of course don't leave dog in car in summer heat!). If you have kids, share these responsiblities with them. (They were probably the ones who wanted the dog in the first place. Teach them that a dog is a lifetime commitment!) The dog is a pack animal. It doesn't handle isolation well. Including the dog into your "pack" activities helps keep those puppy marbles turning and really goes a long way towards giving the dog a fulfilled life and calming it down during those times when the owner is not around. That goes a long way towards reducing bordom barking.

Third, there are all kinds of ways to deal with the barking itself. Teaching a QUIET command. Enforcing that command with a squirt from a squirt bottle. Calling the dog to you when it starts barking at a neighbor. On and on.

The two points I'm trying to make are this: 1. A bark or training collar in this situation is addressing the SYMPTOM, not the PROBLEM. 2. And this I believe is the point that Lucky Luke was trying to make - when a RESPONSIBLE OWNER DEDICATES THE TIME AND TRAINING that a dog requires, behavior problems are rare and negative enforcement devices such as a bark collar are rarely needed.

No Bear I think you've done nothing wrong at all. I think you've taken the high road. I do think your neighbor has neglected her doggie duties, or is at least ignorant of them. And at any rate I think she has shown shallow disregard for her neighbors. And the most innocent victim here - the dog - may have been destroyed had you not stepped in.

Perhaps I could make one suggestion to you... Buy the collar, keep the remote and put the collar on your NEIGHBOR... Now every time the dog barks... :biggrin:

Bear
2007-06-01, 21:38
GGS,
I appreciate your opinion and thank you for your comments. I was not trying to be sarcastic with Lucky Luke but wanted an honest opinion of someone that worked with dogs on a more regular basis to get his “professional” advice. I also realize that the dog was just doing what comes natural and the real problem lies with the owner or neglect of the owner. Let me give you a little history behind all this and try to make a long story short.

My wife and I had only been married a few months. The young couple next door moved and a little old lady bought the house. She was afraid to live alone so she put burglar bars on the house and had the dog. Dog was barking but not too bad. She then had her 30 something year old nephew come live with her because she was afraid. We did not live in a bad neighborhood at all. Come to find out this guy was a convicted child molester. Dog still not too bad. Nephew violates parole and goes back to jail. THANK YOU GOD! She tells my wife she thinks people in the neighborhood don’t like her and it is not a very friendly neighborhood. Noooooooooo! The area is full of young children ours included. Talk about a target rich environment. Then the dog kicks in to high gear. Maybe Chester the molester was keeping the dog quiet. Talked to the lady numerous times but I don’t believe the elevator goes to the top floor. Finally the collar and it works some but since it he can’t be hit each time he barks it is sporadic. Now for the ending. Shortly after our marriage, I sell my house, wife sells her house, we buy new house far away from loud mouth dog and everyone lives happily ever after except the poor people that bought my wife’s old house. Maybe we should have included the collar with the sale.

I do like the advice about putting the collar on her. Once or twice and she would have gotten rid of the dog. I had not thought of that but I have known some kids whose parents need a collar on them. :evil: Maybe our judicial system should try that for a change. That would really get some parents involved and see what their children are up to.

GGS
2007-06-04, 01:33
I love dogs, but I'm not a big fan of dogs on the trail, although it's probably more accurate to say I'm not a big fan of the dogs' owners. Buttt... I realize I'm in the minority,so here's my 2 cents:

1)Teach the dog to wait before going into water, so he doesn't foul it for humans

2)Don't assume others will like having your dog around. Man, I hate hearing "It's OK, he's friendly!" especially after a dog pisses on my pack or sleeping bag, or licks my snack bar, etc. My usual response is "I'm not!"

Jeez, the list goes on. I have met some very nice dogs on the trail, the well-trained ones are a joy to have around, and it's usually a reflection on the owner. Odds are, if the dog's not well-behaved, I don't want to get to know the owner, either.

Did I get up on the wrong side today, or what?:argh:

I think Deadeye makes a good point here. Not everyone likes dogs. Some people are afraid of dogs. It is the responsibility of the owner to train and manage their animal in a way that is thoughtful and respectful to others and the environment. Keeping the dog on a leash (or under full control at all times), no barking, and picking up and properly disposing of puppy "claymores". A responsible owner and well trained pet are usually welcome or at least tolerated. Irresponsible owners lead to complaints, and complaints lead to banning of dogs from parks and trails. Which ruins the enjoyment for those of us with well mannered dogs.

GGS
2007-06-04, 01:53
1. Teach him to distill alcohol
2. Teach him to carry your gear
3. Teach him to cook
4. Teach him to call dominos or order chinese
5. Teach him to run into the liquor store and get your beer
6. Teach him to clean the house
7. Teach him to speak mexican
8. Teach him how to PWN in Halo
9. Teach him gun repair
10. Teach him how to get super hotty hot hot chicks to have the nookie with you

I'm all for #10! :biggrin: Man, the dogs REALLY help in that department. Without the dog good looking women would just run over me with the car and leave me as roadkill. Cozy and I were at a sand volleyball tournament watching the women's playoff bracket and this team of stunning gorgeous athletic women in bikinis (think Gabrielle Reece x2) came over, oh what a CUTE dog you have, blab blab, one gal went to get Cozy some more water, etc. Talked with them for like 1/2 hour until they had to go warm up for their match.

Cozy wasn't the only one with the tail wagging that day...

GGS
2007-06-04, 01:58
Everybody...
Calm, Calm, Calm


........well it works on my dog when she gets over excited.

For the most part the visitors of this site show up with wagging tails, friendly sniffs, and the front-down-butt-up invitation to play. Sadly a few have to glare, go in with an agressive stance, raise their hackles, and scuffle for dominance over everything.

If they were a dog they'd end up at the pound.

Lotta testosterone on this site... Mebbe we should do some more backpacking and burn off some agression...

GGS
2007-06-04, 02:08
Thank you for your advice and best whishes, but we might want to close the discussion here :angel:

For my part I apologize for hijacking your post. Happy trails to you and your dog. Keep us appraised of how things go!

lucky luke
2007-06-05, 17:16
Lucky Luke,
Out of curiosity, how would you have handled my situation of a neighbors barking dog disturbing you? Not just in the morning but at dfferent times of the day also.:banghead: :mad2:

hi,

not knowing the exact situation: i bet the owner missed teaching his dog when he was young. when a dog starts barking (first few times in his life) you can easily stop him just by hugging and calming him down. it takes less than a week to "quiet" a young dog. if you do it at the right time.

i would have taken some time off and spent it training the dog how to behave in the house. how to behave when the neighbor is around, get the neighbor to feed the dog, play him... make them friends.

if you take enough time you can teach your dog almost everything just by playing. unfortunately most of us can not invest the amount of time that would make things so easy, so we depend on harder methods and call them scientific, we give things 25 settings instead of 4 and make them look nice, we beat the dog, with the leash of cause, because with the hand it hurts ourselves. and worst of all, we leave the dog alone much too often for far too long a time. nothing wrong with leaving even a puppy alone. thats just natural for them. but not for 8+ hrs. if you relate to the lifespan this would be like leaving a child alone for 8x7=56 hrs. no wonder the dogs go berserk....

if i was disturbed, i would do the same thing. become the dogs friend. take him out and play with him, work with him... i would try to become part of the family and give the dog no reason to bark.

if the owner would not let me, then i would not really know what to do with this human....

greets
lucky luke

rbd
2007-06-05, 21:29
That's not the way the Vikings trained Norwegean Elkhounds to stop biting humans. Their training methods were so sucessfull that when the US Army tried to train them as attack dogs in WWI the program was a complete failure. Not because the dogs are cowards - they're not. They're one of the few that will stand up to a bear and live. The problem was that too few would attack a human. So they were trained as messenger and work dogs. The Viking technique is still practiced in remote areas of Greenland. When a dog bites a human, that dog is hung along with all other dogs born in the same litter.
The Finnish dog above is from the "new breed". All of the "old breed" raindeer herding dogs went wild during the wars Finland had with Russia (the Winter War, then WWII) and then there was the undeclaired war with Germany. The dog packs were shot after the war.
This new breed Finnish Rain-Deer Herding dog is a beauty. Good luck with it!