PDA

View Full Version : Wood Stove question



GGS
2007-06-20, 03:07
Hey folks,

Question for those of you who have used a wood stove like a sheepherder or Tifaru stove...

So you arrive at your campsite, set up shelter and stove, and fire up your stove, have dinner & whatever & go to sleep. Next day you wake up to a chilly tent so you rekindle/relight stove as needed, in a short time tent is roasty warm, you crawl out of your sleeping bag & have breakfast. Ok so now it's time to pack up and hike on.

...So what do you do with the stove?

1. Do you extinguish the stove or let it burn out? Wouldn't extinguishing it with water make a mess and rust the stove? Wouldn't waiting for it to burn out cold take a long time? Whaddya do?

2. The inside of every stove component has to be sooty. Dissassembling the stove (take down stoves), nesting the pipes, storing the pipe in the stove (non-take down styles) etc has to be a mess, yes? How do you handle this?

3. My sheepherder stove needs sand in the bottom. Ya right, like I'm gonna find sand under 3 feet of snow or in rocky terrain/forest duff. So I'd have to pack it in and/or leave it in the stove from one location to the next. Do all stoves require sand in the bottom? What about the thin lightweight ones? Seems silly to find the lightest stove only to have to bring along several pounds of sand anyway.

dropkick
2007-06-21, 03:35
All the lightweight stoves (that I've delt with) either require sand or dirt to protect the floor of the stove, or have some form of grill to burn on.
Otherwise in time you'll burn through the floor.

You can get around this some by adding another peice of tin (cake pan?) to protect the floor. - Several layers of tinfoil is also a short term protection.

Quenching a stove fire or cooling the stove with water is a bad idea as it is apt to lead to buckling and damage welds (plus the possibility of rust).
Your better off waiting for it to burn out and cool on it's own.
-You can shovel the fire out of the stove and quench it on the ground.

As far as mess: bring gloves and have a dedicated bag for the stove.
With care it's not that bad.

Take-a-knee
2007-06-21, 09:38
Most people who buy and use Kifaru stoves are hunters, not backpackers. They pack into the backcountry, establish a tipi/woodstove basecamp, and hunt in that general area. Most Kifaru gear is designed to enable a hunter to do on foot what traditionally required a horse to accomplish. In that sense, it is ultra lightweight, and top shelf also.

Turk
2007-06-21, 18:01
They are certainly not what I consider ideal for backpacking. However,
if you are already fairly well inducted into the 'lightweight' scene with your gear, it can be added to your pack as a luxury item. My 3 season total pack weight is 20-25 lbs for a 5 night outing. An extra 4 pounds for the stove, is not going to break my back. When I consider the gear I would omit, by taking the stove, I think it would only be about 2.5-3lb increase to my total weight.

But now if you look at guys like Iceman, or Woodswalker that use pulks in winter, it really starts to make sense to buy one. Pulling most of your load anyways...i would put major priority on the stove as part of my winter system.

I plan on buying the kifaru medium sized stove, or titanium goat large stove
before fall camping is here.

As far as mess goes... its all part of it. I've cooked with wood my whole life. I tried hard the last couple years to do the alcohol stove thing, but its just not practical for me. I need fire. Lots of fire. A wood stove can do everything my campfires do, and more. ... and also safer.

- paddling gear is eternally soaked. I spend every night drying clothes on a fire.
Wood stove --- I can't wait! so much safer on my pricey gear.

- cooking ?!? I can't even imagine the luxury of cooking on the flat surface of the wood stove
I am quite certain it beats my rock and stick contraptions and improvised grills.

- warmth?! When I consider how much of my warm clothing I take for the sole purpose of lounging in camp
on cold nights, just to be social with fellow campers instead of retiring to bed early. I could cut major bulk and
considerable weight out of my clothing bag in exchange for the warmth of a wood stove.

Take-a-knee
2007-06-21, 19:50
You are all over it Turk, I agree about alcohol stoves in Canada, probably not a good idea. Probably not a good idea anywhere in the winter north of Florida. I still say that it would be easier to just go to ground in a tipi. I would try a full length ridgerest with one of those ultralight 3/4 length thermarests. Your Rock Wren with a synthetic quilt over it would keep you toasty, and keep any condensation off the down. WW always has a liner in his tipi pics, probably for good reason. The sled is the only way to go. They work well with snowshoes, they work even better with proper skis as long as someone on snowshoes can break trail. Four guys on skiis with one pair of snowshoes is about perfect. Each man can carry survival stuff in a light pack and the guy that is breaking trail puts his pack on the sled.

oops56
2007-06-21, 20:52
O K here one one e bay i was going to get it but to small for my work shop 14 h x 7 w x 12 L with a 3 in. stove pipe

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170124080972&sspagename=ADME:L:RTQ:US:1

GGS
2007-06-22, 01:42
Thanks all for your responses.

I hope my original post did not sound negative towards wood stoves... My intent was quite the contrary. I can think of lots of reasons to carry wood stoves in cold weather! And that's besides the fact that I simply like woodburning stoves.

I was simply trying to imagine the daily life on the trail with a woodburning stove/tent combination and came across some difficulties/drawbacks that I'm curious how experienced wood stove users handle.

Basecamping seems simplest. You just carcamp or pulk your equipment in, set it up, and everything is wonderful for however many days until you have to take everything down.

Life on the trail would be more challenging. Regardless of mode of transportation (backpack, pulk, dog sled, snowmobubble, car camping, etc) lenghty setup and takedown times cut into your day and the mileage you gain. Assembling and dissasembling stoves and tents is what it is of course. But it occured to me that you can't dissassemble a stove - or the tent it is sitting in - until it is at least cool enough to touch and isn't producing smoke which could take a couple of hours. During that time the stove is too cool to throw off useful heat yet too hot to touch. So what do experienced wood stove users do?

Dropkick's suggestion of shoveling out the fire sounds good. Then the remaining stove/sand combo would cool much faster. Course one would have to be careful not to spill hot embers on tent floor and one would need to pack a shovel heavy enough for the task. Is that what people do?

Are there other steps to take to ensure the stove burns out/cools quickly? Have experienced wood stove users found a routine where by the time they've taken care of their camp chores the stove is ready to pack? I haven't done this so I don't know. Seems like my little sheepherder stove in the garage can keep red hot coals for at least a couple of hours.

As for mess of course Dropkick's suggestion sounds good, just pack cheap gloves and put everything in a bag.

How about sand? Does everyone pack sand in? [Assume 3' of snow or sand at locations is otherwise unavailable] Do you leave the sand in the stove from one location to the next? What if the sled tips over, does the sand fall out all over the place? Or should one intentionally purchase a stove with a bottom pan that does not require sand?

These questions may sound dumb, and I'm sure with experimentation I'd find what works. But I am curious what others do.

oops56
2007-06-22, 03:06
Well i guess i give one thing here i keep the wood ash from home you wood stove bring that you that ash pile you dump out side. my stove said to put sand in the bottom do only once now i just keep some wood ash in there. when full i got a 5 gal . can with cover fill that up also hot coals and all put cover on put in a snow pile watch the snow melt.In the summer time in you garden lightly put ashes one your plants keeps the bugs away not much

CoyoteWhips
2007-06-22, 07:53
Are the ashes to insulate the bottom of the pan? Seems like perlite would be a lighter substitute until you had a good pile of ashes.

oops56
2007-06-22, 08:06
Asher are cheaper no need to bring back home

Take-a-knee
2007-06-22, 09:00
GCS, you never use a wood stove in a tent with a floor, you'd burn yourself up post haste. Kifaru tipis don't have floors.

GGS
2007-06-22, 12:34
GCS, you never use a wood stove in a tent with a floor, you'd burn yourself up post haste. Kifaru tipis don't have floors.

Agreed.

The tent I'm eyeballing for car/group camping is a Cabela's Alaknak II. It has a zip out section of floor where the stove sits. There is still tent floor between the stove and the door. So shoveling out the coals would have to be done carefully. ;-)

GGS
2007-06-22, 12:37
Well i guess i give one thing here i keep the wood ash from home you wood stove bring that you that ash pile you dump out side. my stove said to put sand in the bottom do only once now i just keep some wood ash in there. when full i got a 5 gal . can with cover fill that up also hot coals and all put cover on put in a snow pile watch the snow melt.In the summer time in you garden lightly put ashes one your plants keeps the bugs away not much

That's a good idea. Tks, Oops!

dropkick
2007-06-22, 19:15
If your not worried much about weight I would also bring a metal pail. It's a good thing to shovel your burning embers into and quench them. Also handy to have around, for dish washing, and excetera.

I have one that I carry all the time when I'm boat, trailer, or car camping.
I'm extremely cautious about fires and I won't leave one unattended and burning even in an established pit. I dump a pail of water on it, stir, and then repeat. Without a bucket this is a pain in the neck.




- One of the downsides of having a stove and making the area warm is you get Turk sitting around naked and visiting while his clothes dry. :bootyshak

Steinberger
2007-06-23, 00:18
Yeah wood stoves, in my opinion, are the way to go. I just wish I could use them more but since I'm usually in the Smokeys or Pisgah I'm really not allowed... Sigh....

Take-a-knee
2007-06-23, 00:30
GCS, I would buy a Kifaru or Titanium Goat Tipi before I bought that Alanak. For starters, the Alanak isn't Silnylon, when a spark burns a hole in silnylon, you just smear a little GE silicone on it and you no longer have a hole. The guys who make these tipis, use these tipis, they are proven systems, do you think any one at Cabela's uses their tents? I doubt it. You don't need a floor, all you need is a piece of housewrap under your bag.

Iceman
2007-06-23, 01:28
I keep thinking I need a Kifaru or similar, then each time I go hunting, the wind blows like a mutha', and I can see no way to keep the dust out, the wind out, even the mice out. We even find snakes around our camp each day, and I would hate to find one getting snug in my tipi..., I need the floor....

GGS
2007-06-23, 01:38
I keep thinking I need a Kifaru or similar, then each time I go hunting, the wind blows like a mutha', and I can see no way to keep the dust out, the wind out, even the mice out. We even find snakes around our camp each day, and I would hate to find one getting snug in my tipi..., I need the floor....

Iceman, what do you use?

Iceman
2007-06-23, 10:58
We use tents for all of our different types of outings. I have a bunch.

Winter snow overnighters, we use an REI Geodome, probably a fifteen year old tent. We are not camping above tree line, so a more rugged tent is not needed. When snowing, I thump the frame to get snow to slide off....

For hunting, we are camped near the vehicle, so weight is no big deal. I have relied on a weird tent for my hunting camps. It is an Eureka Equinox 3.5 season, self standing tent. My mule deer hunt is at 5000', always windy, can range from 60 degree days to cold in the teens. My elk hunt is at 4000', west side of our state, very wet, seems to rain most of the week long hunt. I would kill for a stove here somehow, but usually rely on hiding under a tarp, with a bottle of whiskey in one hand and a propane heater in front of me, to dry out. Camp fires and elk hunting do not mix well in Western Washington, especially with the constant rain and the smoke stinking up your hunting clothes, associated with camp fires. So propane it is...

I am at the point with my first Equinox, to consider converting this "first" tent, into my kitchen and drying tent. Buy a second tent for sleeping quarters...(car/truck camping for the hunts, the weight would not be a concern at only 18lbs each.) This way I could put a tiny stove or something inside the cook shack and dry clothing each night, without trashing your sleeping quarters.

Many guys in the areas I hunt use wall tents, but they are too damn big, and a major hassle to set up and tear down. I can have my tent packed up in an hour... They also get a ton of mice in their stuff...a constant battle.

On back country solo hunt overnighters I have done, I have just used my Eureka mountain pass 1. Small tent, would not want try a weeks stay in this tent. I have used it down to 10 degrees (one time), and I awoke to a shiny silver ice coffin around me in the morning, ice everywhere, looked spooky...

A kifaru sure looks like a cool way to go, and if i was setting up a spike camp, this looks awesome, I would love to try. The larger kifaru's look like the way to go if you have a few guys, and are all going lightweight, on foot, I can easily see how a stove in this situation would be the second most important component of this system, the tipi being the first. As my kids age, and as they start to hunt with me more, I may sweet talk them into going this route. Lighter, backcountry, tipi and stove.

Woods Walker
2007-06-24, 03:19
They are certainly not what I consider ideal for backpacking. However,
if you are already fairly well inducted into the 'lightweight' scene with your gear, it can be added to your pack as a luxury item. My 3 season total pack weight is 20-25 lbs for a 5 night outing. An extra 4 pounds for the stove, is not going to break my back. When I consider the gear I would omit, by taking the stove, I think it would only be about 2.5-3lb increase to my total weight.

But now if you look at guys like Iceman, or Woodswalker that use pulks in winter, it really starts to make sense to buy one. Pulling most of your load anyways...i would put major priority on the stove as part of my winter system.

I plan on buying the kifaru medium sized stove, or titanium goat large stove
before fall camping is here.

As far as mess goes... its all part of it. I've cooked with wood my whole life. I tried hard the last couple years to do the alcohol stove thing, but its just not practical for me. I need fire. Lots of fire. A wood stove can do everything my campfires do, and more. ... and also safer.

- paddling gear is eternally soaked. I spend every night drying clothes on a fire.
Wood stove --- I can't wait! so much safer on my pricey gear.

- cooking ?!? I can't even imagine the luxury of cooking on the flat surface of the wood stove
I am quite certain it beats my rock and stick contraptions and improvised grills.

- warmth?! When I consider how much of my warm clothing I take for the sole purpose of lounging in camp
on cold nights, just to be social with fellow campers instead of retiring to bed early. I could cut major bulk and
considerable weight out of my clothing bag in exchange for the warmth of a wood stove.

Ok I will try and respond. First off you don't need sand for the bottom of a Kifaru or Ti-goat stove. I have burned both 100's of times and there is ZERO chance of the bottom burning out. I do a large number of winter camps and more Kayak camping this year.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/200705Misc015.jpg

The wood stove is not that messy. The pipe rolls up so with practice my hands now stay kind of clean. If going more UL I pack the take down stove. Some ash will get on my hands but one baby wipe from my pack takes care of that. The take down stove packs to about the size of a laptop. The med Kifaru stove or large Ti goat stove will pack down larger but not by that much.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/rollpipe.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/smallstovefolded.jpg

One must think of these more UL stoves like a campfire in a box as they need to be stoked often. I tend to let them burn down when done than dump the ash. If the ash is still hot I dump water or piss on it. There is never that much and the stove does not burn the land like a campfire. However I am of the school that fire is a natural part of nature and ash is not evil or bad. Some people think that they need to pack out the ash from even a zip stove but this is just crazy. Ash is good for the woods.

Cooking on a wood stove rocks. More like range top cooking.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/smallstove2.jpg

However boil times can be slow but this type of camping is not adventure racing or UL At hike at top speed. I tend to use the stove during fall hunts/camping or winter Steelhead fishing/camping. For summer it is my HH. One thing I would get is a damper. I got a ti-goat damper for my Kifaru stove. The damper makes the stove burn longer and the firebox hotter. Adds about 20% efficiency to the stove. I made a UL stack robber to add even more efficiency to the system.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/100_2264.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/100_2262.jpg

A liner is very nice for wet snow and rain. Condensation is just a fact of life in most single walled tents. Even so-called breathable single walled tent will drip when overloaded with rain or snow (just when you need anti-condensation factors the most). But sometimes condensation can build up for seemingly unknown reasons and other times not at all even when expected. I personally don’t care about it and the reason for my liner was increased heating and draft control of the double wall. The add on liner is one thing I liked about Kifaru tipis. There are lots of good things about the Ti-goat tipi but I needed one with two doors as sometimes I pack in with hounds and they have their own door.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/dog2small.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/100_2250.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/100_2248.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/100_2244.jpg

Some things to consider. The inside temp of a heated tipi shelter can be pushed to well over 100 about the outside temp. The sil nylon can take this and more. The record for me is 158 overall average inside temp (was over 200 near the peak) with an outside temp of 30's. But it is best to burn larger chunks and use a damper if you get one. This way I keep the inside at 80. You can get away with some crazy stuff. During the trip in the below photo it was about 9 outside with some good wind. The 3rd day I took a snow bath butt naked and cleaned up with the infamous baby wipes. Than I just stove dried and put on some warm clothing. This would be a bit harder if I used a campfire alone. This camp was floating on 4 feet of fresh powder.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/ecr1.jpg

But you must take a sleeping bag rated for the temps you expect. True going to bed warm makes the whole night better but the stove will burn down fast (much like a campfire) if not fed. Also I take the appropriate winter clothing. Last winter I went camping. The temps dropped to 5 and didn't even bring a hat or proper jacket. Just my ECWS and was lucky enough to find a sleeping hat inside my EMR's E&E. Froze my butt off setting up the camp and cutting wood. Things got better once the stove was running. The lesson will not be forgotten. Took photos with my cellphone to remind me just how fast the weather can change.


From nice day to oh sh@t it's cold.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/cellphoner1.jpg

Was so happy to get that tipi up and running but do to the cold it took me an hour for the total set up. Tent, Stove and cutting wood. Cold = lower IQ.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/cellphoner4.jpg

Do not get a tent with a floor. There is just a great deal more stuff going on in a heated shelter. Wood and gear being tossed in. Wood stove buring red hot. Cooking etc. You will just screw the floor up. Better to walk into your shelter with your boots on. Also you need not worry about rocks etc. Just your sleeping area needs to be clear. If going light I pack the paratipi and small stove. About 6lbs total. Not super UL but that is for my shelter and stove. I need not pack in any fuel as it is all around me and anyone with ok bushcraft can find dry wood even in the rain. Here is some stove sized wood. This was just after a late season rainstorm turned into the last snow fall of the year. Was snowing as I set up the camp.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/100_4490.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/100_4489.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/Tipi16.jpg

For larger camps it is the bigger tipi and homemade wood stove. I take this as the homemade stove can burn for about 1 hour and the takedown stoves around 30 mintues. I can pack the whole thing in (12 lbs) but tend to use this with the pulk sled or if going in with 2-3 people to even out the load. I use the clothes line to dry my gear in both set ups.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/PULKTRIP2.jpg

But it does take some time.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/PULKTRIP6.jpg

Iceman
2007-06-24, 10:18
WoodsWalker, awesome info and pics! I am sure many can use the insight and real world "reality" of the stove and tipi setups you have shared, thanks. One of these days (years) I would really enjoy trying the tipi set up myself.

A few questions;

Have you tried sliding in a few "wet" pieces of wood alongside your dry wood to extend the burn time? (Too much creosote buildup?)

Also, my guess regarding your condensation buildup, is that you are evaporating alot of moisture in the soils below your setup and they are naturally condensating onto the closest cool item....(see: evapoventicondenrespi... post in Lexicons.....) My question here is, have you ever thrown down a poly floor before bed, to help cut down on moisture creeping up into the structure over night when things cool down?

My experience with wet weather camping has taught me to ditch the cotton pants! :biggrin:

Again, thanks for the write up.

Woods Walker
2007-06-25, 00:54
I have used wet or green wood to hold fire longer in a campfire but this approach tends not to work in these UL stoves. I think all things being equal wet wood has the same potential BTUs as dry but energy must be spent to boil out the water first. What this does to the small firebox is reduce the overall heat. This leads to incomplete combustion. A non-issue for a campfire and a small issue for larger walled tent stoves but the coaling (ash buildup) will soon clog the small UL stoves. Than the extra coals will need to be scraped out. But with nice dry wood (standing deadwood) will burn down to ash. This will reduce the cleaning of the firebox to maybe once every 8 hours with Hardwood and 4-5 with Softwoods. I prefer good hard woods like Oak, Maple and Black Birch. Pine tends to coal poorly and if wet will produce very bad creosote issues that will clog the spark screens and may even collect on inside of the pipe and then burn inside the pipe tossing out sparks. Plus Pine tends to spark very bad increasing the chance of pinholes. Maple is nearly spark free. True my stack robber can burn most creosote and kill the majority of sparks but sometimes when going more UL I don’t pack it. A damper helps keep the sparks at bay when used in conjunction with wire spark screens. Dry fuel can allow for larger chunks that burn down to fine ash. I pack a hatchet and folding saw. Worth the extra 2 lbs as with these tools I can take down standing dead wood Maples (12-15 footers) than saw it up. But someone can break off dead wood limbs and then use hands and feet to snap the wood if they don't have the pack room or with to reduce the pack load. I tend to avoid dead wood on the ground unless I am hardup for fuel. The small wood stove forces a user to learn good bushcraft skills. Something that is forgotten in a world of Pepsi can stoves and Epic bivys.

On the issue of condensation the stove tends to dry the air out very well. Condensation tends to be no higher than the level of the stove during operation and within conditions that are friendly towards condensation. I use a small ground cloth under the sleeping bag and pad. But have found that putting down more ground cloths actually traps water and only makes things worse. Hard to explain but that is what I have found. When packing in the larger tipi with liner I never have a problem.

GGS
2007-06-25, 01:00
Woods Walker, that is a great post! Love all the pictures. Thanks for the info.

I like the tipi. I don't like th $700 price tag. It will be a while before I am ready for such a purchase...

Woods Walker
2007-06-25, 01:22
You could add a stove jack to any floorless tent. Here is a photo that the owners of Ti-goat sent me of their stove and sew-in-jack used on Kiva. I have a Ti-goat jack and they are made very well. Super UL too.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/tigoat.jpg

http://www.basegear.com/mountain-hardwear-kiva-lite.html

Also here is a photo of a homemade stove that uses a roll up pipe and damper from Ti-goat (or Kifaru would work too). It is just a paint can with some kind of home made door.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/homemadestove3.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/homemadestove4.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/homemadestove.jpg

The whole system packed down.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/homemadestove1.jpg

He had a Vertex 5. I think he was charged a total of 350. 300 for tent and maybe 50 bucks for jack add at the shop as this tent does not come with one standard.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/homemadestove5.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/homemadestove6.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/homemadestove8.jpg

Smaller than my Kifaru 4-man but larger than my Kifaru paratipi (not in floor space but rather useable room). Someone else told me that they added a jack to a Golite Hex 3. I have a Hex but with my Kifaru shelters I just never did it. The guy cut away the bug net top vent and added the jack in it's place.

GGS
2007-06-26, 02:45
Woods Walker,

('xcuse me while I wipe the drool off my face)

What size paint gallon can makes that stove? One gallon?

How do you add a stove jack? Where do you find the fireproof material?

(I quiver in anticipation to your post)

-GGS

CoyoteWhips
2007-06-26, 04:13
Also here is a photo of a homemade stove that uses a roll up pipe and damper from Ti-goat (or Kifaru would work too). It is just a paint can with some kind of home made door.

The roll up pipe is wicked cool. I wonder if it'd be a big deal to add a second paint can above the first with an inner baffle to create an heat exchanger? I think it'd remove the need for a damper.

Woods Walker
2007-06-27, 01:24
I would just spend the 40 bucks and get a sew in jsck from Ti-goat.

http://www.titaniumgoat.com/accessories.html

I purchased one and it is very well made. Mine has a Sil rain flap that rolls down when the stove is not in use. I would only put it inside a floorless tent.

I think the paint can is 1 gal. I talked with the guy about building a stove but he could not weld so this is what he came up with. However if you want one that will not rust any stainless container would work. Just cut a 3-inch hole for the pipe and fab some kinda door. I don't know if a second can would work as a heat exchanger as it seems a bit large and less packable. A smaller container might be better. Here is what the plains for mine stack robber looks like.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/robbersmall.jpg

I would also test any homemade stove outside the tent first. Here is a homemade stove that was pop rivited. Some people use steel from 5-inch pipe. Not super packable like a take down stove but very light. But burn off any zinc coating first outside the shelter.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/bakeout-1.jpg

Here is a photo of a large Kikaru stove. It is heavy at 5-6 lbs but it is BIG and takes BIG wood like all of these stoves the large packs down much smaller. I was working on a system to have the pipe go out the side of an A-frame walled tent. But this tent would weight 14 lbs and is for the Pulk sled not back packing.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/100_3193.jpg

Here is a view of just how big the large Kifaru stove is.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/stove0506.jpg

Here is the door of my homemade stove just incase you are looking for Ideas.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/100_2363.jpg

dropkick
2007-06-27, 02:32
Woods Walker,
Not trying to start an argument, but with extended use and no floor protection sooner or later your stove floor is going to get pin holes and then slowly fall apart.
I spent some time last summer working on a stove, fabricating and replacing both the floor that had burnt out and wall panels that had started to.
Now this was a fairly old oven that got heavy use, but it still happened.
And I know of others that ended up the same.

GGS
2007-06-27, 03:04
Woods Walker,
Not trying to start an argument, but with extended use and no floor protection sooner or later your stove floor is going to get pin holes and then slowly fall apart.
I spent some time last summer working on a stove, fabricating and replacing both the floor that had burnt out and wall panels that had started to.
Now this was a fairly old oven that got heavy use, but it still happened.
And I know of others that ended up the same.

Are you referring to the wall/floor of the STOVE or the TENT?

In either case, what do you recommend for preventing such pin holes?

CoyoteWhips
2007-06-27, 11:10
Heating Stoves (http://www.crest.org/discussiongroups/resources/stoves/apro/Heat/Heating%20Stoves%20LO-RES.pdf) (pdf)

This pdf has some nice ideas about heating stoves; the cover illustrates a giant household size version of that heat exchanger I mentioned. The disadvantage of packing a heat exchanger might be offset by cutting and hauling less fuel.

Take-a-knee
2007-06-27, 12:35
I think the Kifaru and TiGoat stoves don't burn out as fast as cheaper stoves because SS and Ti have little or no carbon in them.

Turk
2007-06-27, 18:49
Hey, this is a pretty friendly forum around here. If someone thinks they see a potential situation where the bottom of these stoves may wear out. Please don't hold back your comments.

As someone who just dropped $600 on one, I would greatly appreciate any and all advice that may prevent damage to my new stove.

Woods Walker
2007-06-27, 23:39
I have had Mild steel stove bottoms burn out but NEVER a Ti or Stainless steel stove. I know this because I have burned my small Kifaru stove 100's of times. I have the pleasure of camping out with Patrick Smith the owner of Kifaru. We talked about this topic. He is one of the few people I know that burns his stove more than me. Mild steel yes. I agree 100% but this is not that animal. Yes these small UL stoves will warp all the hell but they come back into shape. Don't worry Turk. I have had both the stove and whole pipe red hot with flames shooting out the top and everything is just fine. Ti is even better than the Stainless in this regard. My Ti-Goat rollup cylinder stove is just as thin as the Ti stove pipe. It held up just Fine and the Vertex stove is made of heaver Ti stock.

GGS.

To keep pinholes down I would use a damper and spark screens. I even use this combo with the stack robber. But don’t over do it, as your draft will be reduced too much. After maybe 3 years of use I only got 2 small pinholes in my paratipi and zero in my 4-man with 2 seasons under it’s belt. The pinholes in the paratipi resulted for some problem fuels (pine) and only using one slide in spark screen. A dab of SilNet took care of it.

Woods Walker
2007-06-27, 23:52
Here is my Ti-Goat rollup cylinder stove

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/minibobstove1.jpg

It is so UL.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/minibobstove.jpg

If this was mild steel I don't think the thing would last long.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/minbobstovetest.jpg

However not the best cooker so I tend to pack it in my winter day pack with the paratipi. Just incase I get lost or something stupid happens.

As for Stainless here is some photos of my stoves and stack robber red-hot. 100's of burns and years of use. Or should I say abuse. Covered in water and snow. Stored wet. Food and hot drinks dumped all over them.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/smallstoverobber.jpg

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/robber1.jpg

Cell phone photo.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/cellphone6.jpg

The inside of my Kifaru small stove after 3 years of use. Ignore the plate near the top of the firebox as this is a homemade baffle plate. I stopped using this as the firebox was just too small but it should be a winner in the larger stoves.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/baffel.jpg