PDA

View Full Version : Longterm cache foodstuffs?



dropkick
2007-12-05, 06:49
This isn't exactly a hiking question but....

I've got some land up in the Bitterroot Mountains and I have a trailer that's parked there more or less permanently. - My lazy man's replacement for building a cabin.

Anyway....I've been thinking that I'd like to have some food there that I can just stick in a cupboard and leave until needed. Possibly for a few years before replacing.

Any suggestions?

pure_mahem
2007-12-05, 08:53
Canned goods like chef boyardee and dinety more beef stew. if you leave anything like cereal or in boxes of that type you can be opening your self for invasion of squirels mice and other critters. you also need to take into consideration that if it gets way below freezing the can goods might not last through the winter. you could always through some jerky in a glass jar, lol!
I would say anything that you would just need to add water to would be okay but you definately have to protect the package somehow from critters, maybe by putting them in canning jars or what not.

Iceman
2007-12-05, 10:03
MRE's.....

Amigi
2007-12-05, 17:39
Two good places for ideas. The second one deals more with feeding an army, but you'll get the point:
http://standeyo.com/News_Files/menu.food.store.html
http://www.fcs.uga.edu/pubs/current/FDNS-E-34-1.html

All long term food should have O2 absorbers with it. I've used these before overseas:
http://www.mgc-a.com/ageless/product.html

CoyoteWhips
2007-12-05, 19:12
There ain't nobody got long term food storage down as good as the Mormons.

Just for fun, I plugged "LDS food storage" in google. I thought Pleasant Hill Grain (http://www.pleasanthillgrain.com/foodpak1.aspx) had some cool packages. Check out the itemized lists of long term foods.

Amigi
2007-12-05, 23:18
Pleasant Hill Grain (http://www.pleasanthillgrain.com/foodpak1.aspx)

I think you'd die from rabbit starvation from this. 18 grams of fat per day is nowhere near what the body requires. Also, it says paraphrased "1 year emergency food ration, only requires cooking oil obtained locally". That's an oxymoron if I ever read one.

Now I like their Foodpack 4. That fits more along with what dropkick was looking for. I might look into this one myself. It has double the fat and lower carbs and protein. Could be broken down for hiking and $260 aint bad for 60 days worth of hiking food I could keep around for a year. Heck I spent $20 a day each time I day hike.

sailingsoul
2007-12-06, 07:01
Then there's the old joke, What's the one thing that can feed you for a year?
One Mormon! If you do stock, plan on low profile (don't tell). Who has noticed that the first thing that happens when the sun comes out after a Hurricane, all the stores are looted of everything that isn't tied down. I am amazed how fast people run out of food. Like 8 hours????? Of course I under stand running out of beer that fast but food? SS :captain:

Amigi
2007-12-06, 07:28
I never ran out of beer during Charlie or Frances, who you talking to?:D

But yeah, it was funny how everyone, every single neighbor, was down at the firestation getting can goods by day 2. Some of these ppl couldnt even cook on a friggin grill.

I went down on day 7 because I was getting sick of canned food, and the fireman told me that today was the last day. No one else was around, so he opens up the back of a trailer and says, "Take whatever will fit in your truck, whatever we have left is going to the landfill." I almost dropped dead. He said it didnt make them happy either, but to prevent it being illegally sold, they had no choice. Government waste at it's finest. And we want these ppl running our health care?

pure_mahem
2007-12-06, 09:54
I'd like to get my hands on that mix a meal cook book from that sight. I could make almost everything else they sell on that sight with my food dehydrator and then store it with the vaccum sealer. I know some of that kit involves using there grinder to make your own flower from the grain. Very very interesting. my gerbil has really got my little wheel spining now, lol!

CoyoteWhips
2007-12-06, 15:04
I'd like to get my hands on that mix a meal cook book from that sight.

If I were still living in Utah, I could probably get somebody to give me an extra one. However, I can buy a Mix a Meal (http://waltonfeed.com/mix-a.html) on the web!

JAK
2007-12-06, 15:30
Honey is extremely dense for fast carbs in terms of energy per volume and has natural preservatives, so it won't go bad unless you add water. Of course if you do add water you can get mead, which ain't bad either. You probably can't go wrong with mollasses either, which might be better for some things like beans.

Beans, though it might be the second night before you can enjoy them, unless of course you have some canned beans for the first night.

Slow carbs is a little more tricky. Flour and oats for making biscuits and porridge and I suppose dried soups and vegetables as long as you seal them all airtight. There are tricks to this I understand, to kill all the bugs before sealing them in. CO2 I think. Can be done with a candle I read some place?

For meat, I presume that's why your there.
If that fails, I understand that's what the beans are for.

JAK
2007-12-06, 15:37
I heard a funny thing last night for the first time. I wouldn't be surprised if it is common knowledge but I have never snared rabbits before. Our rabbits here are actually Varying Hares. Anyhow, what I heard was when the temperature gets down to 0F or so you need to make the loop a bit bigger, because the bunny ears are frozen. Other practical information I was told was that it should be a bit higher off the ground once there is snow cover and the bottom food is eaten up because the rabbit runs with his head a bit higher up. Also, on a full moon you will catch much fewer because they will be more likely to see the snare. Also to thaw them before skinning. I think that's about it. Anyways, probably common knowledge, but I thought the frozen ears was very interesting and funny in a way.

Amigi
2007-12-06, 17:44
... but I thought the frozen ears was very interesting and funny in a way.

You're a sick man.:wink:

pure_mahem
2007-12-06, 19:56
Shhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....don't tell the animal activists they'll be trying to but ear warmers on thos wabbits! (insert elmer fud laugh here) LOL

dropkick
2007-12-07, 00:59
Jak,

Just a few tidbits of knowledge.

Hares can get frozen ears without causing damage, rabbits can't. If a rabbit's ear freezes it rots and falls off (if the rabbit survives it and doesn't get gangrene).

Never used a snare except to learn how, so don't know about the snow and the light.
I have killed rabbits -not hare- with a thrown stick before. It isn't that difficult. Off hand the only wild animal that I think is easier to kill is a grouse, and they'll keep pretending that they're a stick until you're only a couple feet away from them.

A candle would give you CO not CO2. CO is bad.

You use dry ice (frozen CO2) to drive out the oxygen in the container. The CO2 is heavier than oxygen (or over all air) so as it turns to vapor (have the opening of the container on top) it will fill the container and drive the air out. Then you seal the container.

JAK
2007-12-07, 03:50
Not much CO2 though. Very little I understand, unless smoking badly.

Interesting about the rabbits and hares. I wonder how the hares do it.

The other thing I picked up was that the best time to hunt them with a 22 here is in the fall after 2 or 3 frosts, in an Eastern White Cedar swamp (. Not a true swamp. Anyhow they like living amongst Cedar and after 2-3 frosts they are white and really stand out I guess.

Iceman
2007-12-07, 10:04
We have so damn many coyotes out here you are hard pressed to find a good rabbit population to hunt, really a bummer...the brush so thick, you cant find the coyotes to shoot em...

GGS
2007-12-07, 12:15
We have so damn many coyotes out here you are hard pressed to find a good rabbit population to hunt, really a bummer...the brush so thick, you cant find the coyotes to shoot em...

Iceman, is trapping illegal in your state?

pure_mahem
2007-12-08, 05:22
how bout shooting them after they come in to eat the gut pile from a butchered livestock animal? Use to do that on the farm fun as hell until one get right up behind you and lets out that yelp, talk about the hair standing up on the back of your neck.

Iceman
2007-12-08, 16:11
GGS, trapping was outlawed here a few years back. This is the left coast, one of the most liberal pussy whipped areas in the country. Get me the hell out of here!

pure_mahem
2007-12-08, 23:12
Vermont is nice! Don't need any type of permit for the toys! But they don't let you shine fields like they do in new york. You can shine a field if you are coyote or racoon hunting as long as you only have a 22. Vermont no shining allowed period even if you don't have a gun. only head lamp and flashlight for varmint hunting.

Rosaleen
2007-12-09, 10:13
Dropkick-

If you want to keep some foods that YOU actually like on the shelf, stash a few Mountain House or other FD pouches that you like in a metal can in your portable cabin. Spray the OUTSIDE of the can with Permethrin. This, of course, assumes that you like FD food. Sometimes I buy some for convenience, but I like my own concoctions better.

If you have the time and ambition, dehydrate some basics: Veggies, lean meats, etc., then package into glass jars and vacuum seal the jars. Canning jars with rubber seal or previously vacuumed commercial jars with a rubber compound seal will preserve and protect from oxidation, rhodents, and insects. You will have a quicker to prepare meal if the foods are precooked before dehydrating, including rice and pasta. You can dehydrate some meals and rehydrated them sucessfully, but you need to experiment to see what works and what you like. You may not want to be out in the boonies and find out your food is bad.

Precooked foods may not keep as long, at least as far as food value is concerned. You still need to blanch raw foods to stop enzymes from causing food deterioration. Dehydrating frozen foods skips this step, as the packers have already done it.

Best of luck!

Rosaleen

GGS
2007-12-10, 02:26
GGS, trapping was outlawed here a few years back. This is the left coast, one of the most liberal pussy whipped areas in the country. Get me the hell out of here!

Well the nice thing about a liberal state is it sets a crash-and-burn example for the rest of us on how to NOT do things.

My recent dog-trap experience had me reading up on trapping. There are several predator animal populations that cannot be controlled effectively without trapping, coyotes being one of them. When predator populations increase they can drive prey populations - some of which are on the endangered list already - to the brink. "Pussy whipped liberals" in 6 states successfully pushed for a trap ban, and predator populations exploded to the point where coyotes were even threatening humans. All other forms of hunting proved ineffective. Legislators in two of the states had to act to overturn the ban in order to bring the predator populations under control.

You're always welcome to come live in Michigan, great hunting community, where despite one of the highest tax rates in the country the state is about to go bankrupt because there are more people (unemployment, welfare, etc) taking from the government than paying in... (So I've been told, I'm researching the validity of this)

dropkick
2007-12-12, 08:23
You want to cut down on coyote populations you could do what they did here.
Bring in wolves.
Wolves will kill coyotes on sight.
Getting rid of any competition.

Of course they also kill your calves, sheep, llama, an odd horse now and again, and your dogs.

CoyoteWhips
2007-12-12, 08:26
You want to cut down on coyote populations you could do what they did here.
Bring in wolves.
Wolves will kill coyotes on sight.
Getting rid of any competition.

Of course they also kill your calves, sheep, llama, an odd horse now and again, and your dogs.

Ah! But that's when you bring in the lions!

Take-a-knee
2007-12-12, 10:00
Roasleen's idea about metal cans is an excellent one, and the best metal can is probably a GI ammo can. Check the gaskets on them when you buy, and putting a little armorall on the gasket is probably a good idea. You might want to invest in one of those vacuum packers if you don't have one, it is the best way to store game and veggies for the freezer, and a really good way to store dry food products to keep them fresh. Things like pasta should store a long time vacuum packed.

If you really want to stock up maybe a root cellar would be an idea, in your neck of the woods that might be a deep dig to get below the frost line.

JAK
2007-12-12, 13:01
Found a good recipe for pemmican. Its all over the internet.
It is a little vague on what jerky is, as it can vary considerably.

Serves: 3 Cups
Ingredients:
1 c Jerky; beef or venison
1 c Dried Saskatoon berries or
-dried blueberries
1 c Unroasted sunflower seeds or
-crushed nuts of any kind
2 ts Honey
1/4 c Peanut butter
1/2 ts Cayenne [optional]

Instructions:
This version uses peanut butter rather than melted suet or lard as the
binding agent, which is more palatable for today's health conscious diets.

Grind [or pound] the dried meat to a mealy powder. Add the dried berries
and seeds or nuts. Heat the honey, peanut butter and cayenne until
softened. Blend. When cooled, store in a plastic bag or sausage casing in a
cool dry place. It will keep for months.

From: Edible Wild Fruits and Nuts of Canada,
published by the National Museums of Canada,
ISBN 0-660-00128-4

You could vary the amount of fat and sugar in the jerky, but this is one estimate of the total calories for one serving:
http://www.recipezaar.com/73313
1 batch = 223 g
Calories = 1245 kcal
Protien = 49g
Fats = 104g
Carbs = 52g
Fibre = 19g

I think if I messed with the ingredients a little it might suit me.
How do you eat the stuff? Could you mix it with oats?