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Gray Blazer
2011-01-08, 23:06
I said a mouthfull.

dixicritter
2011-01-08, 23:11
HHQ is a family owned and operated website. At this time Rock and I are the only ones that would moderate anything.

We have no say in what happens over there and harbor no ill will to that site.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-08, 23:22
I did not mean to come off negatively. Just venting to any friends I may have over here.
I'll be back.

4eyedbuzzard
2011-01-09, 02:36
I did not mean to come off negatively. Just venting to any friends I may have over here.
I'll be back.
Funny you should mention it. I just got bit by a gator the other day over there. I'm told it will take a week to heal. I probably, okay definitely, deserved it. I shouldn't have stuck my hand right in its mouth. :shot: But it was really fun at the time.

Hooch
2011-01-09, 08:53
That thin skinned bastard put me in hack for 2 days over something that wasn't even a violation of TOS. Crap on him.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-09, 20:20
Alligator's prolly lurking over here and I say to him, "you can't have it both ways, Allibaitor."

I posted that there were no alligators at HHQ and you know how long that lasted. About 5 mins. Apparently I violated TOS # 10.

Anyways, I think I'll raise my post count here for now.

sheepdog
2011-01-09, 20:26
Alligator's prolly lurking over here and I say to him, "you can't have it both ways, Allibaitor."

I posted that there were no alligators at HHQ and you know how long that lasted. About 5 mins. Apparently I violated TOS # 10.

Anyways, I think I'll raise my post count here for now.

a little quieter here but safer

Gray Blazer
2011-01-09, 20:28
Everythings better here. We just need to dazzle the newbees with our hiking brilliance.

Kanga
2011-01-09, 21:28
Everythings better here. We just need to dazzle the newbees with our hiking brilliance.

you mean scare them with our retardedness.

Superman
2011-01-09, 21:38
Everythings better here. We just need to dazzle the newbees with our hiking brilliance.

HUH:cguru:

Bulldawg
2011-01-09, 21:42
I hiked into a nice mountaintop campsite Friday night which was covered with a light dusting of snow by the time supper was done. It was 27F inside the tent over night and I liked to burned up. Is that hiking brilliance?

Mags
2011-01-10, 00:50
I hiked into a nice mountaintop campsite Friday night which was covered with a light dusting of snow by the time supper was done. It was 27F inside the tent over night and I liked to burned up. Is that hiking brilliance?


Don't know if if is brilliance..but is sure sounds nice (seriously).

Bulldawg
2011-01-10, 00:53
Don't know if if is brilliance..but is sure sounds nice (seriously).

It was pretty sweet. No big miles, but a nice night out with our kids.

4eyedbuzzard
2011-01-10, 02:18
you mean scare them with our retardedness.
:hmmmm2: I don't get it :stupido2: Oh! :itsme:

Lone Wolf
2011-01-10, 02:21
I said a mouthfull.

or mags. he shut down a thread that didn't need shutting down. thanks sly

4eyedbuzzard
2011-01-10, 02:24
or mags. he shut down a thread that didn't need shutting down. thanks sly
Can we talk about THAT subject here?

Lone Wolf
2011-01-10, 02:25
of course. but sly may cry to a moderator cuz we're doubting his boy sam

4eyedbuzzard
2011-01-10, 02:43
Yeah, I noticed that. I was going to wager with a guy over on Sam's site. I think they saved him a Franklin or two when they took the comments down.

I sent Sam's "support" people an email basically strongly suggesting they get him home. He's got acute tendinitis (Achilles tendon) and his psychological condition is questionable. Walking on roads with a loaded pack is probably the worst thing for it - just continue to aggravate it. No cure but some rest. And that would be one long, cold, and LONELY hike through NY and PA this time of year. Told them that perhaps they should pull down the website and give his tendon and his ego some time to heal (I would hope his ego is severely bruised anyway), let everything blow over, and maybe pursue a somewhat less ambitious and definitely less (un)publicized hike later this year. I feel sorry for him in some ways, but at the same time it's impossible not to call BS on it and have some fun at the expense of anyone that ... brash? conceited? overconfident? whatever?

Just another WB thread cut down just when things were getting interesting.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-10, 09:38
Just another WB thread cut down just when things were getting interesting.

Happens all the time. Freakin' stupid stuff.

Mags
2011-01-10, 11:18
or mags. he shut down a thread that didn't need shutting down. thanks sly

It went on for 27 pages.

The guy quit.

It was no longer a speed record attempt or endurance hike.

So what was the point? Let you and Sly write your initials in the snow? ;)

To paraphrase you, it was only a thread about walking. :beer:

Mags
2011-01-10, 11:21
[QUOTE=4eyedbuzzard;212170
Just another WB thread cut down just when things were getting interesting.[/QUOTE]


Naaah...the guy quit.

The forum is about speed/endurance hiking. His farce of a journey was neither.

So, what's the point in continuing?

I have a pretty light hand for a moderator. I just not see the point in continuing to beat the dead horse while the fat lady was singing. :D

mudhead
2011-01-10, 11:46
Funny you should mention it. I just got bit by a gator the other day over there. I'm told it will take a week to heal. I probably, okay definitely, deserved it. I shouldn't have stuck my hand right in its mouth. :shot: But it was really fun at the time.

People might be looking for you. Don't be shy. Did you ever send that kid some money?:)

Amigi
2011-01-11, 12:02
Whatchya been doing, Grayblazer? Nice to see you again.

Amigi
2011-01-11, 12:13
Why not just leave WB there and focus on HHQ stuff when your here? That site went to shit three years ago during the presidential election.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-11, 12:40
Why not just leave WB there and focus on HHQ stuff when your here? That site went to shit three years ago during the presidential election.

Hey brother, are you back in FL? If so are you going to the Hammock Hangers Hangout at Buck Lake on the weekend of Jan 21?

Bearpaw
2011-01-11, 19:35
Make your point with your Paypal. Don't donate over there until Gator takes a permanent vacation. Simple enough. Very few of the newbies ever donate. Regulars are leaving or at least refusing to donate. Give it time.

Two Speed
2011-01-11, 19:39
I'm good with that program.

warraghiyagey
2011-01-11, 21:23
Make your point with your Paypal. Don't donate over there until Gator takes a permanent vacation. Simple enough. Very few of the newbies ever donate. Regulars are leaving or at least refusing to donate...

. . . or being escorted from the premises. . . :angel:

4eyedbuzzard
2011-01-12, 00:35
. . . or being escorted from the premises. . . :angel:
No birds were harmed in escorting buzzard to his cage.

rhjanes
2011-01-12, 10:39
or mags. he shut down a thread that didn't need shutting down. thanks slySeems several times a month, they get their hammock straps in a bind and close about 10 threads. half of which do NOT need closed. Closing a 2 year old thread, just because it is two years old and someone posted a comment or asked a question? Sorry, I don't get it.....:bike:

Lone Wolf
2011-01-12, 11:07
Seems several times a month, they get their hammock straps in a bind and close about 10 threads. half of which do NOT need closed. Closing a 2 year old thread, just because it is two years old and someone posted a comment or asked a question? Sorry, I don't get it.....:bike:

power trippin' muthafuckas

4eyedbuzzard
2011-01-12, 11:13
Seems several times a month, they get their hammock straps in a bind and close about 10 threads. half of which do NOT need closed. Closing a 2 year old thread, just because it is two years old and someone posted a comment or asked a question? Sorry, I don't get it.....:bike:
It's all just part of the kinder, gentler New World Order.

Everything is beautiful... - thanks (EDIT) Ray Stevens. [I can't remember shit lately]

I'd say more, but I have to go take my daily dose of Soma.

SGT Rock
2011-01-12, 11:19
It's all just part of the kinder, gentler New World Order.

Everything is beautiful... - thanks Stevie

I'd say more, but I have to go take my daily dose of Soma.

Great reference. If you don't like it you can go live on an Island somewhere.

4eyedbuzzard
2011-01-12, 16:04
Scumbag thread is closed. I feel better now, kinda warm, and fuzzy. The butterflies are back out too.

Lone Wolf
2011-01-12, 19:24
Yeah, I noticed that. I was going to wager with a guy over on Sam's site. I think they saved him a Franklin or two when they took the comments down.

I sent Sam's "support" people an email basically strongly suggesting they get him home. He's got acute tendinitis (Achilles tendon) and his psychological condition is questionable. Walking on roads with a loaded pack is probably the worst thing for it - just continue to aggravate it. No cure but some rest. And that would be one long, cold, and LONELY hike through NY and PA this time of year. Told them that perhaps they should pull down the website and give his tendon and his ego some time to heal (I would hope his ego is severely bruised anyway), let everything blow over, and maybe pursue a somewhat less ambitious and definitely less (un)publicized hike later this year. I feel sorry for him in some ways, but at the same time it's impossible not to call BS on it and have some fun at the expense of anyone that ... brash? conceited? overconfident? whatever?

Just another WB thread cut down just when things were getting interesting.

sammy's as good as done. he's on his 3rd night in a motel. he'll be home in a coupla weeks. end of epic journey

Tin Man
2011-01-12, 20:37
Great reference. If you don't like it you can go live on an Island somewhere.

I tried an Island somewhere. Too boring.

Tin Man
2011-01-12, 20:38
sammy's as good as done. he's on his 3rd night in a motel. he'll be home in a coupla weeks. end of epic journey

Oh do tell, what was this one trying to do? Set the snow show speed record?

4eyedbuzzard
2011-01-12, 20:59
Oh do tell, what was this one trying to do? Set the snow show speed record?
It's way too hard to explain in ten easy to read paragraphs, so check out the madness at http://www.theinitiativesite.com/

Tin Man
2011-01-13, 00:26
It's way too hard to explain in ten easy to read paragraphs, so check out the madness at http://www.theinitiativesite.com/

oh yeah, i wrote off this poser after 2-3 posts.

ed bell
2011-01-13, 00:34
HHQ is a family owned and operated website. At this time Rock and I are the only ones that would moderate anything.

We have no say in what happens over there and harbor no ill will to that site.

This ought to cover it...are there really questions beyond this?

Tin Man
2011-01-13, 00:35
This ought to cover it...are there really questions beyond this?

ya, just one, who is alligator??

ed bell
2011-01-13, 00:37
ya, just one, who is alligator??

A reptile that lives in the swampy regions of the American Southeast?

Bulldawg
2011-01-13, 00:40
ya, just one, who is alligator??


A reptile that lives in the swampy regions of the American Southeast?

And one that I hope is reading over here somehow. Because if he is, if he continues to selectively moderate and leave slanderous posts about someone on a public forum and then make smart ass remarks about the thread himself, well, he just might find the owner of said website funding my thru hike. Just saying, ya know............

Lugnut
2011-01-13, 01:03
Any chance of getting Weasy as your counsel? :angel:

Gray Blazer
2011-01-13, 08:08
And one that I hope is reading over here somehow.

You know he is.

Amigi
2011-01-13, 14:38
Hey brother, are you back in FL? If so are you going to the Hammock Hangers Hangout at Buck Lake on the weekend of Jan 21?

No. Got my dad down on vacation for his birthday. That and it's too cold!

As for me, back in Florida living in Sanford. Come spring/summer, we need to get together again.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-17, 21:42
I know he can take care of himself, but, did sumthing happen on WB in the last few days concerning Lone Wolf and why did Wise Old Owl want me to change my signature to a lone wolf quote. WOO said it would be funny. As usual with me everything is over my head.

Lone Wolf
2011-01-17, 21:44
nothin' happened to me :albertein

Kanga
2011-01-17, 21:59
nothing happened to wolf, he just made a funny comment. and you just ruined it.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-17, 22:08
I plead the 5th commandment.

Wise Old Owl
2011-01-17, 22:14
GB its all in harmless fun, I have nothing in my heart against LW.

Lone Wolf
2011-01-17, 22:16
I plead the 5th commandment.

honor your father and mother?

Gray Blazer
2011-01-17, 22:17
I have no clue what is going on. I was just being a good sheeple and doing what I was told.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-17, 22:17
honor your father and mother?

That too.

Wise Old Owl
2011-01-17, 22:48
GB too funny

Gray Blazer
2011-01-25, 19:05
Guess what? I googled inseam and it is not a bad word. Does Allibaitor have a dirty mind?

Rockhound
2011-01-25, 19:28
I really don't think it's in good taste to make fun of moderators who donate their time and have to put up with a lot of headaches from a bunch of smartalecs. It's a thankless job and I for one feel Gator should be shown a lot more respect and a lot less ridicule.

Rockhound
2011-01-25, 19:29
I'd tell him this too if I wasn't banned from Whiteblaze.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-25, 19:42
I'd tell him this too if I wasn't banned from Whiteblaze.

Maybe I should get myself banned from WB, too. I'd be in good company.

Tin Man
2011-01-25, 19:46
Maybe I should get myself banned from WB, too. I'd be in good company.

indeed, the best in fact :p

Amigi
2011-01-25, 22:38
I've been off WB for a very long time. Is ATTroll still in charge over there? Maybe bring me up to speed of the last two years.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-25, 22:53
I've been off WB for a very long time. Is ATTroll still in charge over there? Maybe bring me up to speed of the last two years.

What's up, brother?

ATtroll did a thru-hike last year. Allibaitor has been modding like a bitch. He thinkis everything is a personal attack or whatever. Other guys can prolly tell you more, but, that's my take. Whargy tried to keep it lite but he wasn't appreciated. Mweinstone is the voice of reason(we're all in trouble) and LW still gets in pithing contests cuz he is pithy.

4eyedbuzzard
2011-01-26, 10:26
Mweinstone is the voice of reason
WB deserves all the MW reasonableness it can get.

Amigi
2011-01-27, 00:59
I noticed 4 outta every 5 posts was by MW. I couldnt stand his posts then, and they are worse now. At least he doesnt seem to be on shrooms and has learned punctuation in the last three years.
I guess if I wanna talk hiking, I'll come here. I've been unemployed for almost a year now, so my feet have gotten lots of miles on them since Mar of last year. Most of my day/short trip gear is perfected, next will come my LDH gear perfecting. I doubt I'll ever do the AT, kinda hackneyed and overpopulated for me. The CDT looks just about right.

Gray Blazer
2011-01-30, 22:12
I liked Matty's online radio show. Other than Matty, WB is pretty boring these days.

rhjanes
2011-01-31, 10:12
I noticed 4 outta every 5 posts was by MW. I couldnt stand his posts then, and they are worse now. At least he doesnt seem to be on shrooms and has learned punctuation in the last three years.
I think they are worse also. He's learned punctuation and spelling? I hadn't noticed. I get a headache just reading his runingon scentences thta talk about th rlevancce of the qualiyt off how many puonds his gaer wears becas hes gotta hav this undepants to drve thebus ovr adn wee only work whhen we donnt haaaver a job to wlak theRV over.

dixicritter
2011-01-31, 10:56
I think they are worse also. He's learned punctuation and spelling? I hadn't noticed. I get a headache just reading his runingon scentences thta talk about th rlevancce of the qualiyt off how many puonds his gaer wears becas hes gotta hav this undepants to drve thebus ovr adn wee only work whhen we donnt haaaver a job to wlak theRV over.

Matty? Is that you? :adore:

Gray Blazer
2011-01-31, 12:08
In Peru or sumwhere in that there S. America, they wear yellow unnerpants for New Years. I guess that hides the stains ifn you drink too much beer and pee yourself.

Roche
2011-02-01, 17:08
matthewski's post are better than most, i.e.
- I plan to hike in two years, what will the temperature be?
- Should I use a red or blue one?
- What does AT stand for?
Most questions are either dumb, already answered, or google-able. But I do like reading the sarcastic comments before they are alligatorized.

Skidsteer
2011-02-01, 18:40
matthewski's post are better than most, i.e.
- I plan to hike in two years, what will the temperature be?
- Should I use a red or blue one?
- What does AT stand for?
Most questions are either dumb, already answered, or google-able. But I do like reading the sarcastic comments before they are alligatorized.

What's your username on WB?

Roche
2011-02-01, 21:08
Skids

My username on WB is

Gray Blazer
2011-02-02, 00:33
Skids

My username on WB is

Prolly Alligator.

dixicritter
2011-02-02, 18:46
Prolly Alligator.

Naw man look at his signature line... it's Roche... lol

Big Mac
2011-02-03, 00:12
Prolly Alligator.


Naw man look at his signature line... it's Roche... lol

Duh.

Roche
2011-02-03, 21:55
Dix

Now that my secret identity has been revealed, would it be to much of a bother to change my username to

Big Mac
2011-02-03, 21:59
To what ????






(jk)

dixicritter
2011-02-03, 23:18
Dix

Now that my secret identity has been revealed, would it be to much of a bother to change my username to

No trouble at all. :beer:

Roche
2011-02-04, 21:15
Thanks:adore:

warraghiyagey
2011-02-04, 22:33
No trouble at all. :beer:

Can you change my screen name to Roche also please? . . .

saimyoji
2011-02-04, 22:45
hi dixie,

i'm tired of being saimyoji. could you change my username to Roche?

thanks. :beer:

Big Mac
2011-02-04, 22:54
I would like to change my name to






Roche
:beer:

Ray
2011-02-04, 22:57
Can you change my screen name to Roche also please? . . .I want to be Warraghiyagey.

dixicritter
2011-02-04, 23:19
Can you change my screen name to Roche also please? . . .

No :aetsch:


hi dixie,

i'm tired of being saimyoji. could you change my username to Roche?

thanks. :beer:

No :aetsch:


I would like to change my name to


Roche
:beer:

No :aetsch:


I want to be Warraghiyagey.

Be careful what you ask for. :aetsch:

MonkeyBoy
2011-02-04, 23:54
Can you change warrghy's screen name to "Buttnoodle"?

warraghiyagey
2011-02-05, 09:49
Can you change Monkeyboy's name to Jerkball? . . .

warraghiyagey
2011-02-05, 09:50
I want to be Warraghiyagey.



Be careful what you ask for. :aetsch:

Sage advice. . . :bath:

Tin Man
2011-02-05, 10:37
can you change my name to rockhound

Hog On Ice
2011-02-05, 10:43
change Tin Man to Sn Humanoid

warraghiyagey
2011-02-05, 10:45
Change Tin Man to Pig Upon Frozen Water. . .

saimyoji
2011-02-05, 10:47
change warrgy to sphincter spelunker

warraghiyagey
2011-02-05, 10:54
Change Saimyoji to Fartguy . . . thingy. . . .


:star:

Tin Man
2011-02-05, 11:07
change wharggy to ... wharggy

Bearpaw
2011-02-05, 22:13
change wharggy to ... wharggy

Dude, haven't you heard? There's no such thing as a Warraghiyagey! :argh:

Tin Man
2011-02-05, 22:15
Dude, haven't you heard? There's no such thing as a Warraghiyagey! :argh:

that's why he should change... if there was one, we could tell him what a fudge packer he is :albertein

Roche
2011-02-06, 18:13
The previous posts were downright funny.

The hell with that old guy named

dixicritter
2011-02-06, 20:55
They have their moments. LOL

Hog On Ice
2011-02-06, 22:23
unfortunately the best parts are behind them

Gray Blazer
2011-02-07, 11:25
Can you change my screen name to Roche also please? . . .

No you can't cuz that's pronounced roach and if you did that roach on WB it would be a violation of TOS and we don't want you to get banned again.

enviro
2011-02-07, 11:38
Warghhey...roachclip may still be available.

Roche
2011-02-07, 12:49
No you can't cuz that's pronounced roach

Actually the autentic ancient Gaelic pronounciation is "warraghiyagey" with emphisis on all letters, vowels and syllables.

Listen closely as I say

Big Mac
2011-02-07, 16:35
Ha ha - he said Gaelic.

Lugnut
2011-02-07, 17:09
I thought Warraghiyagey was gaylick. Now I'm confused. :argh:

4eyedbuzzard
2011-02-08, 09:44
Now I'm confused. :argh:

Now? What exactly were ya before? :aetsch: :beer:

Wise Old Owl
2011-02-21, 21:44
no confusion you can't smoke a cockroach or use chemicals on WB.

Gray Blazer
2011-02-28, 13:05
Hey Sarge/Dixie-I sold another Pic and Frame this morning!!

Wise Old Owl
2011-02-28, 18:58
GB a pic & frame of what?

Gray Blazer
2011-02-28, 20:56
GB a pic & frame of what?

I take hundreds of pics when I'm on the AT and the ones that come out good I blow up and make some Appalachian barnwood frames for them. Skids has one. (I traded for some stoves) and Rock and Dixie have 3. They were the first to buy one of mine. Winton Porter owner has a couple that I traded for a tent and a sleeping bag.

Skidsteer
2011-02-28, 21:06
Yep. Mine's hanging on the wall. Love it.

Beautiful photo of Overmountain shelter.

Gray Blazer
2011-03-03, 08:39
Hey Alligator and all other WB mods. Have fun with your little friends.

MonkeyBoy
2011-03-03, 09:19
Say hello to my little friend.

http://trekmovie.com/wp-content/uploads/platos/tosr067-13.jpg

Tin Man
2011-03-03, 11:02
Go easy on Gator... it's a medical issue...

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQyzJ857ysToLKBd_Hk7KdW0ChobVTcy Ifr3lbnYirzB--Ynelg

Gray Blazer
2011-03-03, 23:05
Hey Alligator and all other WB mods. Have fun with your little friends.

My apologies to you WB guys. I can still post at home, just not at work. The Powers that Be must have notice the 5000 posts made while I'm supposed to be working.

Your favorite Fu(K+ard ... Gray Blazer

Tin Man
2011-03-04, 06:58
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_GR__xpUsOyo/TSsQ4ijgdEI/AAAAAAAAV_Y/KITyrjYVrU0/s1600/loser.jpg

Superman
2011-03-09, 09:52
My apologies to you WB guys. I can still post at home, just not at work. The Powers that Be must have notice the 5000 posts made while I'm supposed to be working.

Your favorite Fu(K+ard ... Gray Blazer
That's what you get for ...having a job. Just sayin:angel:

Gray Blazer
2011-03-10, 08:26
Yeah, you would think I would know better.

Tin Man
2011-03-10, 10:16
Yeah, you would think I would know better.

no, we wouldn't :aetsch:

atraildreamer
2011-03-19, 15:20
At this time Rock and I are the only ones that would moderate anything.

OK, but Dixi is the final authority... :captain: She tells Rock "jump!..." and he says "Yes Maam...How high?"... :afraid: :biggrin:

(Just kidding Rock! You've got a good woman there! :adore: )

dixicritter
2011-03-19, 23:54
OK, but Dixi is the final authority... :captain: She tells Rock "jump!..." and he says "Yes Maam...How high?"... :afraid: :biggrin:

(Just kidding Rock! You've got a good woman there! :adore: )

You so funny!

And thanks for the compliment. :)

zoidfu
2011-03-25, 16:16
I'm proud to say that I have a lifetime ban from Whiteblaze... though I pop up from time to time with different profiles.

All it took was shoving direct evidence of his hypocrisy in his face in a PM during our arguing about my six week ban.

Tin Man
2011-03-25, 16:27
awesome. nice work! :beer:

MonkeyBoy
2011-03-25, 16:59
All it took was shoving direct evidence of his hypocrisy in his face in a PM during our arguing about my six week ban.

Like it's really hard to do that......

zoidfu
2011-03-26, 11:28
I did it well enough to get a lifetime ban.

Tin Man
2011-03-26, 11:34
excellent!

sheepdog
2011-03-26, 14:13
I did it well enough to get a lifetime ban.

your life or gators life???:bandit:



I know a guy, that knows a guy :bandit:

Take-a-knee
2011-03-30, 01:48
I did it well enough to get a lifetime ban.

I did too, but it was worth it. I don't miss the place a damn bit.

Weary
2011-03-30, 23:15
ya, just one, who is alligator??
a jerk

Weary
2011-03-30, 23:25
Go easy on Gator... it's a medical issue...

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQyzJ857ysToLKBd_Hk7KdW0ChobVTcy Ifr3lbnYirzB--Ynelg
I asked a WBer once, How tall is Alligator? Sadly, he didn't know.

MonkeyBoy
2011-03-30, 23:26
Have we been moderated, Weary???

Weary
2011-03-30, 23:38
Have we been moderated, Weary???
I've been banned for various periods, several times. Lately, Alligator has just kicked me off threads for what strikes me as foolish reasons, most recently when I suggested that trail maintenance should take precedent over trail magic.

I asked him why, and he suggested I grow up. I'm already quite old, so I thought I'd look elsewhere.

I think it is sad what is happening to White Blaze. I've tried gently to improved the administration. But the site seems committed to committing suicide.

MonkeyBoy
2011-03-30, 23:39
Fools usually have foolish reasons.

Tin Man
2011-03-30, 23:52
I've been banned for various periods, several times. Lately, Alligator has just kicked me off threads for what strikes me as foolish reasons, most recently when I suggested that trail maintenance should take precedent over trail magic.

I asked him why, and he suggested I grow up. I'm already quite old, so I thought I'd look elsewhere.

I think it is sad what is happening to White Blaze. I've tried gently to improved the administration. But the site seems committed to committing suicide.

sad, yes, but who the f cares. it is just a website and this website is much better. stick around and we can chat and stuff.


i hear a new wind farm is going up near baxter, or someplace?

Lugnut
2011-03-30, 23:55
sad, yes, but who the f cares. it is just a website and this website is much better. stick around and we can chat and stuff.


i hear a new wind farm is going up near baxter, or someplace?

That was probably the wrong thing to say! :albertein

Tin Man
2011-03-31, 00:01
That was probably the wrong thing to say! :albertein

whut? you don't want weary to stick around? he's a fine fellow with a rich and deep understanding of the issues of our day. that, and he despises reptiles that lurk in dark places.

Lugnut
2011-03-31, 00:06
whut? you don't want weary to stick around? he's a fine fellow with a rich and deep understanding of the issues of our day. that, and he despises reptiles that lurk in dark places.

Sure. He should stick around. I admire his tenacity. :angel:

Big Mac
2011-03-31, 08:25
Sure. He should stick around. I admire his tenacity. :angel:

Is using big words like tenacity allowed over here?

Tin Man
2011-03-31, 08:30
Is using big words like tenacity allowed over here?

if the inseam is off, probably not

John B
2011-03-31, 12:37
I haven't been here in a long while. I'd forgotten what it's like to have a place where posts aren't moderated.

MonkeyBoy
2011-03-31, 13:01
I haven't been here in a long while. I'd forgotten what it's like to have a place where posts aren't moderated.

Dixi,

I'm offended by this post.........can we please have it removed?!?!?

Thanks.

:)

Skidsteer
2011-03-31, 13:05
Dixi,

I'm offended by this post.........can we please have it removed?!?!?

Thanks.

:)

Yeah John B used the M word. Shouldn't that be on the banned word filter or something?

Tin Man
2011-03-31, 15:07
Yeah John B used the M word. Shouldn't that be on the banned word filter or something?

oh dear, that shouldn't be ... frag his ass

Weary
2011-03-31, 15:29
....i hear a new wind farm is going up near baxter, or someplace?
Wind projects are being proposed across Maine. But the one that is most pending and which most effects the trail is propoised to be constructed northeast of the Bigelow Preserve. The turbines would impact many miles of the trail from Avery peak through the Carry Ponds. It is being opposed by MATC, and by many people living in small hamlets in the area.

Tin Man
2011-03-31, 15:45
Wind projects are being proposed across Maine. But the one that is most pending and which most effects the trail is propoised to be constructed northeast of the Bigelow Preserve. The turbines would impact many miles of the trail from Avery peak through the Carry Ponds. It is being opposed by MATC, and by many people living in small hamlets in the area.

assuming you are with matc on this and that conservation is enacted, where do you propose ME fulfills its energy needs?

MonkeyBoy
2011-03-31, 15:54
Coal

Tin Man
2011-03-31, 16:00
Coal

exactly. what we have 500 year supply or something

MonkeyBoy
2011-03-31, 16:04
By then, we'll be burning baby harp seals.

John B
2011-03-31, 16:19
By then, we'll be burning baby harp seals.

I don't care who you are, that's just funny.:congrats:

Weary
2011-03-31, 16:21
assuming you are with matc on this and that conservation is enacted, where do you propose ME fulfills its energy needs?
Maine already gets more than half it's electrical energy from alternative sources. We have biomass boilers, and a lot of hydroelectric dams. A number of biomass boilers have been shut down over the years because the cost of the energy wasn't competitive.

Wind energy -- and a lot of fossil fuel energy, for that matter -- is competitive only because the federal government subsidizes its development.

I'm inclined to believe that governments should stop their subsidization of energy and let the markets work for a bit. It would be interesting to see what happens.

MonkeyBoy
2011-03-31, 16:31
I don't care who you are, that's just funny.:congrats:

:beer:Thank you.....I'll be here all week:beer:

MonkeyBoy
2011-03-31, 16:32
I'm inclined to believe that governments should stop their subsidization of energy and let the markets work for a bit. It would be interesting to see what happens.

I'll agree with you 100% on that one...

Tin Man
2011-03-31, 16:52
I'm inclined to believe that governments should stop their subsidization of energy and let the markets work for a bit. It would be interesting to see what happens.

wow, didn't know you had it in you. excellent.

Tin Man
2011-03-31, 16:53
I don't care who you are, that's just funny.:congrats:

please, don't feed the monkey's ego. he is spank happy enough without this sort of thing.

Kanga
2011-03-31, 18:18
holy shitballs. weary, we agree! i'm gonna go sit down for awhile now.

Skidsteer
2011-03-31, 18:24
I'm inclined to believe that governments should stop their subsidization of energy and let the markets work for a bit. It would be interesting to see what happens.

I'll tell you what would happen. Real hope and change.

Good post Weary.

Furlough
2011-04-01, 04:51
Maine already gets more than half it's electrical energy from alternative sources. We have biomass boilers, and a lot of hydroelectric dams. A number of biomass boilers have been shut down over the years because the cost of the energy wasn't competitive.

I wonder what the energy costs will need to rise to before options like biomass boilers can be competitive? We seem to be finally moving toward sustained higher fuel costs now.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-01, 09:45
We have a Waste-to-Energy Facility here in our county that produces 75 megawatts of electricity per hour burning trash. Enough to supply 45,000 homes with electricity from trash.

The ash is then sifted to remove aluminum and steel for recycling. Remaining ash is used for roadway construction and landfill cover.

warraghiyagey
2011-04-01, 22:35
We have a Waste-to-Energy Facility here in our county that produces 75 megawatts of electricity per hour burning trash. Enough to supply 45,000 homes with electricity from trash.

The ash is then sifted to remove aluminum and steel for recycling. Remaining ash is used for roadway construction and landfill cover.

:beer::beer:

rhjanes
2011-04-02, 11:48
We have a Waste-to-Energy Facility here in our county that produces 75 megawatts of electricity per hour burning trash. Enough to supply 45,000 homes with electricity from trash.

The ash is then sifted to remove aluminum and steel for recycling. Remaining ash is used for roadway construction and landfill cover.and the ultra-greenies would pount out the polution of the air from burning.....



Here in Texas, they set up TONS of windfarms out west. It was so funny to see all the back slapping by all the greenies. Until their faces fell when confronted with "um, when the wind stops blowing strong enough, will it be OK that YOUR house has it's air conditioning and computer turned off? You know the issue is RELIABLE electricity, correct?".

That all said, it ALL needs to be part of the equation.

harryfred
2011-04-04, 10:07
Sooo, This where all the cool kids went. Starting visiting WB after not for several months and It was all sterile and bland. Tried yanking some chains on threads that were dead or dying and couldn't get any bites Shelterleopard tried but she is as piss poor with a come back as I am. Then I found out Jester annoyed the humorless once too often. Still not sure what all happened but if I had known I would not have renewed my donation. Oh and this site has much cooler smiles:aetsch::bootyshak:beer:

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-04, 10:15
and the ultra-greenies would pount out the polution of the air from burning.....



Here in Texas, they set up TONS of windfarms out west. It was so funny to see all the back slapping by all the greenies. Until their faces fell when confronted with "um, when the wind stops blowing strong enough, will it be OK that YOUR house has it's air conditioning and computer turned off? You know the issue is RELIABLE electricity, correct?".

That all said, it ALL needs to be part of the equation.

Actually, with all the carbon scrubbers (or whatever they call them) the air coming out is virtually clean of emissions.

I know a guy that works there.....he said it's mostly water vapor coming out.

Weary
2011-04-04, 12:18
Actually, with all the carbon scrubbers (or whatever they call them) the air coming out is virtually clean of emissions.

I know a guy that works there.....he said it's mostly water vapor coming out.
Here's how I've been told to distinquish what's coming out of an industrial stack. If there's a gap between the top of the stack and the white cloud it's mostly water vapor condensing into tiny droplets of water as it hits the colder air. If it comes out of the stack directly as a white cloud it's pollution of some kind.

As I understand it there are no "carbon scrubbers." Carbon dioxide is extremely difficult to remove. Laws require most other harmful substances to be at least partially removed. But virtually clean remains mostly a dream.

ed bell
2011-04-04, 21:05
Here's how I've been told to distinquish what's coming out of an industrial stack. If there's a gap between the top of the stack and the white cloud it's mostly water vapor condensing into tiny droplets of water as it hits the colder air. If it comes out of the stack directly as a white cloud it's pollution of some kind.

As I understand it there are no "carbon scrubbers." Carbon dioxide is extremely difficult to remove. Laws require most other harmful substances to be at least partially removed. But virtually clean remains mostly a dream.

OK...I've got to say it, CO2 is one of the building blocks of life and isn't a harmful substance. While it is recognized as a "greenhouse gas", the amount of temperature increase caused by man's extra input through the burning of fossil fuels is in question. There are no peer reviewed studies that claim to have cracked the formula for CO2's net effect on surface temperatures, and all current levels of CO2 concentration and temperature averages fall completely within the realm of natural variability.

And CO2 is a colorless gas........here we go.....

Nearly Normal
2011-04-04, 22:34
Plant more trees....

sheepdog
2011-04-04, 22:37
save the ales!!

Big Mac
2011-04-04, 22:42
and the ultra-greenies would pount out the polution of the air from burning.....



Here in Texas, they set up TONS of windfarms out west. It was so funny to see all the back slapping by all the greenies. Until their faces fell when confronted with "um, when the wind stops blowing strong enough, will it be OK that YOUR house has it's air conditioning and computer turned off? You know the issue is RELIABLE electricity, correct?".

That all said, it ALL needs to be part of the equation.

You do know that the homes aren't hooked up DIRECTLY to the windmills, right?

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-04, 23:47
Here's how I've been told to distinquish what's coming out of an industrial stack. If there's a gap between the top of the stack and the white cloud it's mostly water vapor condensing into tiny droplets of water as it hits the colder air. If it comes out of the stack directly as a white cloud it's pollution of some kind.

As I understand it there are no "carbon scrubbers." Carbon dioxide is extremely difficult to remove. Laws require most other harmful substances to be at least partially removed. But virtually clean remains mostly a dream.

I will check it out the next time I drive by as to the smoke coming out.

But I can tell you that it's a heck of a lot cleaner than coal or oil.

And there is some sort of filter. The plant had one of the furnaces shut down not to long ago, voluntarily, to fix the filtration to be more efficient.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-04, 23:49
OK...I've got to say it, CO2 is one of the building blocks of life and isn't a harmful substance. While it is recognized as a "greenhouse gas", the amount of temperature increase caused by man's extra input through the burning of fossil fuels is in question. There are no peer reviewed studies that claim to have cracked the formula for CO2's net effect on surface temperatures, and all current levels of CO2 concentration and temperature averages fall completely within the realm of natural variability.

And CO2 is a colorless gas........here we go.....

And trees do need CO2 to produce more O2.

saimyoji
2011-04-04, 23:52
http://www.spencersonline.com/images/spencers/products/interactivezoom/processed/00954313.interactive.a.jpg

ed bell
2011-04-05, 00:25
It's a shame that resources are dedicated to remove CO2 from emissions when there are plenty of other actually harmful pollutants to tackle.... like the evolving problem of disposing of expired batteries that propel automobiles...nasty stuff there.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-05, 00:30
That's why I have to laugh when people go "green" and get hybrid vehicles and flourescent light bulbs, which cause more pollutants than the counterparts they are to replace.

ed bell
2011-04-05, 00:34
It's enough to make someone who believes in conservation wonder where all the gains have gone....

Weary
2011-04-05, 00:35
.....There are no peer reviewed studies that claim to have cracked the formula for CO2's net effect on surface temperatures, and all current levels of CO2 concentration and temperature averages fall completely within the realm of natural variability. And CO2 is a colorless gas........here we go.....
Sorry. There are thousands of peer reviewed studies that document CO2's effect on surface temperatires, dating back more than a century. Scientists began worrying in the 1800's about the impact of CO2 from fossil fuels on global temperatures. Virtually all the research since has documented that the worry was legitimate.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-05, 00:37
Exactly. It's all a feel good, do nothing solution.

Hybrid vehicles take more energy to create, run and dispose of than a Hummer in the life of the vehicle, and cause more pollutants during creation and disposal, but yet are considered "green"........go figure.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-05, 00:46
Sorry. There are thousands of peer reviewed studies that document CO2's effect on surface temperatires, dating back more than a century. Scientists began worrying in the 1800's about the impact of CO2 from fossil fuels on global temperatures. Virtually all the research since has documented that the worry was legitimate.

Human CO2 output is about a tenth of the CO2 output every day from volcanic activity, and doesn't include forest fires, swamp gases, burning peat fires, or CO2 just plain given off by ground sources, and these have been doing so for billions of years since the Earth was formed..........

Weary
2011-04-05, 00:48
Exactly. It's all a feel good, do nothing solution.

Hybrid vehicles take more energy to create, run and dispose of than a Hummer in the life of the vehicle, and cause more pollutants during creation and disposal, but yet are considered "green"........go figure.
We need documentation!!!

Weary
2011-04-05, 00:51
Human CO2 output is about a tenth of the CO2 output every day from volcanic activity, and doesn't include forest fires, swamp gases, burning peat fires, or CO2 just plain given off by ground sources, and these have been doing so for billions of years since the Earth was formed..........
But somehow the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere has nearly doubled recently. Virtually all the peer reviewed scientific studies suggest industrial and automobile pollution are the cause.

ed bell
2011-04-05, 00:53
Sorry. There are thousands of peer reviewed studies that document CO2's effect on surface temperatires, dating back more than a century. Scientists began worrying in the 1800's about the impact of CO2 from fossil fuels on global temperatures. Virtually all the research since has documented that the worry was legitimate.

Please cite the peer reviewed literature that attributes a quantitative part of the 0.6 degree Celsius rise in the recorded "average global temperature" of the last 100+ years to Anthropogenic CO2 emissions. Put an estimate on it backed by real science..... That's the real question here....you say scientists worried about temperatures in the 1880's? They probably wanted much warmer conditions....cold killed untold amounts of people in the centuries before the industrial revolution, the end of the 1800's were particularly brutal.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-05, 01:00
Oh, good grief, Weary......do your own research.

I'll point you in the right direction. Popular Mechanics had an indepth feature article on the same subject.

Conclusion........biodeisel vehicles are less energy to create, more energy efficient, have less emissions and cause less pollutants when disposing than any hybrid.

ed bell
2011-04-05, 01:00
But somehow the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere has nearly doubled recently. Virtually all the peer reviewed scientific studies suggest industrial and automobile pollution are the cause.

There is no doubt civilization has added CO2 to the atmosphere in massive amounts over the past 120+ years. Lets not forget that CO2 levels have exceeded nearly quadruple the amount we have now in the past.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-05, 01:04
AND keep in mind Weary.....when I say less emission and less energy, I mean from creation, to use, to disposal. From dusk to dawn, so to speak.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-05, 01:06
Not to mention that even Consumer Reports has been stating that hybrids do not give the MPG ratings that the manufacturer's have been stating. Reality is much, much lower.

Nearly Normal
2011-04-05, 01:32
Lots less trees world wide to convert co2 than just 50-75 years ago.

Weary
2011-04-05, 01:42
Oh, good grief, Weary......do your own research.

I'll point you in the right direction. Popular Mechanics had an indepth feature article on the same subject.

Conclusion........biodeisel vehicles are less energy to create, more energy efficient, have less emissions and cause less pollutants when disposing than any hybrid.
Well, Popular Mechanics has not had any peer reviewed articles recently that I can recall. However, I'm a firm believer in real science, not the extremes on both sides of these issues.

I once wrote a book deploring all the silly things environmental groups were trumpeting in the name of progress. I don't own a hybrid vehicle, Nor do I expect to.

But that doesn't mean that adding CO2 to the atmosphere, is harmless. Nor can I cite a quantitative study that spells out the precise balance between manmade CO2 and natural CO2. Those of us who know a bit about science know such a precise study is impossible. But is also beside the point.

Nature is in balance. That balance has impacted the earths climate since the beginning of time. The mining and consuming of billion year old carbon upsets that natural balance, and lacking any evidence to the contrary, almost certainly is impacting the earths climate today.

I'd be glad to debate anyone who thinks this isn't true.

sheepdog
2011-04-05, 06:12
I don't believe in moose, Sasquatch, black hikers or global warming.


Oh and aliens.

Hog On Ice
2011-04-05, 08:19
I believe in Sasquatch - met him night hiking over Hightop about 10 years ago

Two Speed
2011-04-05, 09:26
Not to mention that even Consumer Reports has been stating that hybrids do not give the MPG ratings that the manufacturer's have been stating. Reality is much, much lower.If you get the EPA rated mileage out of any vehicle, hybrid, turbo diesel, SUV, Hummer, motorcycle, whatever, you're driving like a senior citizen looking for an address. That could be due to the fact that the driving cycle used to determine mileage resembles . . . oh, say . . . a senior citizen looking for an address.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-05, 09:31
Well, Popular Mechanics has not had any peer reviewed articles recently that I can recall. However, I'm a firm believer in real science, not the extremes on both sides of these issues.

I once wrote a book deploring all the silly things environmental groups were trumpeting in the name of progress. I don't own a hybrid vehicle, Nor do I expect to.

But that doesn't mean that adding CO2 to the atmosphere, is harmless. Nor can I cite a quantitative study that spells out the precise balance between manmade CO2 and natural CO2. Those of us who know a bit about science know such a precise study is impossible. But is also beside the point.

Nature is in balance. That balance has impacted the earths climate since the beginning of time. The mining and consuming of billion year old carbon upsets that natural balance, and lacking any evidence to the contrary, almost certainly is impacting the earths climate today.

I'd be glad to debate anyone who thinks this isn't true.

I would believe non-biased Popular Mechanics and Consumer Reports on vehicle efficiency over a Grant Based scientist every time.

Why? The Grant based scientist is being paid to prove a specific outcome.

And yet the findings were that the new biodiesels were much less harmful overall. So why the big push for hybrid vehicles?

Answer - You don't get big government grants to research technology that we've had at our fingertips for years.

Answer - Car manufacturer's can't gouge you for the price of the vehicle for technology that we've had at our fingertips for years.

Answer - Government can't regulate technology that we've had at our fingertips for years.

So when they say it's a "Green" vehicle, they mean it.............but in this case green means money.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-05, 09:33
If you get the EPA rated mileage out of any vehicle, hybrid, turbo diesel, SUV, Hummer, motorcycle, whatever, you're driving like a senior citizen looking for an address. That could be due to the fact that the driving cycle used to determine mileage resembles . . . oh, say . . . a senior citizen looking for an address.

So you're telling me Consumer Reports is just overlooking this fact for every other vehicle on the market????

Two Speed
2011-04-05, 09:54
I was referring to EPA's driving cycles, really not familiar with Consumer Report's methods.

Weary
2011-04-05, 10:52
I don't believe in moose, Sasquatch, black hikers or global warming. Oh and aliens.
I can't vouch for sasquatch, and aliens. But I've seen quite a few moose and black hikers -- and experienced global warming, or at least Maine warming.

Weary
2011-04-05, 11:09
If you get the EPA rated mileage out of any vehicle, hybrid, turbo diesel, SUV, Hummer, motorcycle, whatever, you're driving like a senior citizen looking for an address. That could be due to the fact that the driving cycle used to determine mileage resembles . . . oh, say . . . a senior citizen looking for an address.
EPA doesn't drive cars to get its mileage figures. It's all done in a laboratory. The vehicle's drive wheels are placed on a machine called a dynamometer that simulates the driving environment—much like an exercise bike simulates cycling.

The energy required to move the rollers can be adjusted to account for wind resistance and the vehicle's weight.
Consumer Reports mileage estimates are based on the mileage they get when testing the cars, I believe. The CU figures tend to be lower than the EPA estimates.

My 2003 Subaru Forester got better mileage than CU said when it was new. Now at 145,000 miles it gets a bit less.

Russell
2011-04-05, 11:15
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/04/opinion/04krugman.html?_r=2&src=me&ref=general

Two Speed
2011-04-05, 11:28
EPA doesn't drive cars to get its mileage figures. It's all done in a laboratory.That would help explain why EPA's numbers usually don't bear much resemblance to reality. Might be useful for comparison, but probably not much more than that.
Consumer Reports mileage estimates are based on the mileage they get when testing the cars, I believe. The CU figures tend to be lower than the EPA estimates.Sounds about right.
My 2003 Subaru Forester got better mileage than CU said when it was new. Now at 145,000 miles it gets a bit less.My Ford Ranger is getting lower mileage these days, too. I suspect that's due to a combination of a worn engine (170,000+ miles) and the 10% ethanol mix sold in the metro Atlanta area. When I can find 100% gasoline the mileage gets back within 1 - 2 MPG of what I got when I bought it.

BTW, my method to calculate MPG is to fill the tank, reset the trip odometer to zero, drive like a maniac until I'm down to about a quarter tank, refill the tank and calculate the MPG based on miles driven divided by gallons consumed. Prolly not gee-whizzy enough for EPA, but I consider that as what the vehicle delivers under the conditions I actually drive in, and screw a bunch of estimates.

OK, I do believe we've JAK'd this one to death.

sheepdog
2011-04-05, 22:35
I can't vouch for sasquatch, and aliens. But I've seen quite a few moose and black hikers -- and experienced global warming, or at least Maine warming.

Since:
A. There are no such thing as moose.
and
2. I've never seen a black hiker

Therefore:
Your information on global visa vie Maine warming is suspect.

Scientifically speaking.:albertein

Nearly Normal
2011-04-05, 23:25
Now that's funny.
:bike:

mudhead
2011-04-06, 08:56
.My Ford Ranger is getting lower mileage these days, too. I suspect that's due to a combination of a worn engine (170,000+ miles) and the 10% ethanol mix sold in the metro Atlanta area.



Ford Ranger 50,000 miles. Mileage dropped after 10% ethanol mix. 15%+

On a highway run it dropped from 25 to 20.

JAK
2011-04-06, 11:48
OK, I do believe we've JAK'd this one to death.I've been verb'd. :D

Two Speed
2011-04-06, 11:49
Ayup. :beer:

Tin Man
2011-04-06, 13:12
Say, I heard this site had boobs... oh wait, it does. Just not the kind I was looking for. Go figure.

sheepdog
2011-04-06, 14:25
That ain't no way for a hiking legend to talk.

Wise Old Owl
2011-04-06, 23:33
when did Fair and Balanced slip into this?

ed bell
2011-04-07, 01:43
<snip>But that doesn't mean that adding CO2 to the atmosphere, is harmless. Nor can I cite a quantitative study that spells out the precise balance between manmade CO2 and natural CO2. Those of us who know a bit about science know such a precise study is impossible. But is also beside the point.

Nature is in balance. That balance has impacted the earths climate since the beginning of time. The mining and consuming of billion year old carbon upsets that natural balance, and lacking any evidence to the contrary, almost certainly is impacting the earths climate today.

I'd be glad to debate anyone who thinks this isn't true.

CO2 is indeed a "greenhouse gas" and adding it to the atmosphere most certainly has an effect. The scientific aspect of this involves the atmosphere, physics and our climate. I get that, and I also think the earth has been warming since the Little Ice Age subsided in the late 1800's despite the gradual rise in CO2 since.

I know a little bit about science, yet I'll have to disagree that there can't be precise studies to evaluate the role of CO2 as an agent of climate forcing. We have a worldwide temperature record that goes back around 120 years (many inconsistencies, incomplete records and station biases) which indicates there has been an increase in "average global temperature" of around 0.6 degrees Celsius. Comparing this record against the clues paleontological evidence provides us gives us a fairly decent starting point when it comes to comparing CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere compared to surface temperatures, except for the recorded temperature measurements part.....that is more involved and subjective....

For those who adhere to the AGW hypothesis, the recent increase is due, in large part, to the addition of CO2 to the atmosphere through burning fossil fuels.
For those who adhere to the CAGW (Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming) hypothesis, it is due to CO2, and in the future, positive feedback, which will continue accelerated warming unabated till the planet is uninhabitable due to drastic climate change/ geographic changes (massive sea level rise, loss of agricultural sustainability due to climate shift, etc...).

Neither of those are the null hypothesis, even though we are being slowly pushed to believe otherwise....the scientific method is being turned upside down by folks claiming that models and projections constitute settled science while they won't even admit that current temperatures, while on the upper end of the scale during the recorded era, are in fact well within the long term statistical norm. The short term truth doesn't even sit well, the last 13-14 years have seen no warming as far as the "average global temperature" goes. That is directly contrary to anything I've seen models predict since James Hansen's first doomsday predictions in the late 1980's.

All I'm asking for is to have the scientific method out in front when this subject is being debated.....in case anyone needs a refresher, here's a quote from wikipedia (full article with the link) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method

"Scientific inquiry is generally intended to be as objective as possible, to reduce biased interpretations of results. Another basic expectation is to document, archive and share all data and methodology so they are available for careful scrutiny by other scientists, giving them the opportunity to verify results by attempting to reproduce them. This practice, called full disclosure, also allows statistical measures of the reliability of these data to be established."

zoidfu
2011-04-07, 01:44
Obama.

Tin Man
2011-04-07, 10:51
....the scientific method is being turned upside down by folks claiming that models and projections constitute settled science while they won't even admit that current temperatures, while on the upper end of the scale during the recorded era, are in fact well within the long term statistical norm. The short term truth doesn't even sit well, the last 13-14 years have seen no warming as far as the "average global temperature" goes. That is directly contrary to anything I've seen models predict since James Hansen's first doomsday predictions in the late 1980's.


my father did a speech a couple of years ago on global warming. he is a retired scientist and had no preconceived notions on the topic and lots of time to do his own homework. his research indicated that are many factors affecting 'global warming', in no particular order;

1) measurement stations - many are placed in hot spots and not scientifically disbursed.
2) location, location, location - metropolitan areas are warming faster than non-metropolitan areas. ripping out trees to put up buildings and paving over dirt are replacing natural sunlight absorbers with reflective materials that sends heat into the atmosphere.
3) volcanic activity, as pointed out by monkeyboy and others, eclipses all man-made greenhouse gases.
4) yes, man-made co2 contributes to greenhouse gases, but no one at all has a clue how much real affect it has.

Well, we can't measure properly, 'greenhouse' panic types leave out the effects of other factors and just focus on man-made gases, and we yell at countries who tear down jungles while we, in the US, continue to strip the earth. So, are we addressing real problems or just targeting one that may not be as big a deal as others?

Gray Blazer
2011-04-07, 11:39
I know I'm just a moron f***tard but ...

... the weatherpeople can't even get the weather right for next week. How can they predict 10-20 years from now?

... when I went to school 40 years ago, the scientist were predicting a new ice age. What happened?

... after the 04 hurricanes and Katrina we were supposed to have super hurricanes hitting the USA for the next several years. What happened to them?

... isn't global warming caused by the sun?

... how did we start talking about this?

... if you negatively mention Al Gore on WB, Alligator will delete your post. Can you guess why?

Tin Man
2011-04-07, 11:44
... if you negatively mention Al Gore on WB, Alligator will delete your post. Can you guess why?

they are buds sharing the same affliction... global methane gas sniffers

similar to pack sniffers, but more interested in gas

sheepdog
2011-04-07, 11:49
Seems like someone for some reason always wants to keep the public scared. Global warming, y2k, coming ice age...just another way for the man to keep a brotha down.

Big Mac
2011-04-07, 12:19
I know I'm just a moron f***tard but ...

... the weatherpeople can't even get the weather right for next week. How can they predict 10-20 years from now?

... when I went to school 40 years ago, the scientist were predicting a new ice age. What happened?

... after the 04 hurricanes and Katrina we were supposed to have super hurricanes hitting the USA for the next several years. What happened to them?

... isn't global warming caused by the sun?

... how did we start talking about this?

... if you negatively mention Al Gore on WB, Alligator will delete your post. Can you guess why?


The only one of these I can believe with total certainty is your first statement. :aetsch:

zoidfu
2011-04-07, 12:22
It's amazing that more people believe in magical skygods than they do in peer reviewed research...

sheepdog
2011-04-07, 12:27
It's amazing that more people believe in magical skygods than they do in peer reviewed research...

Exactly, it's nice to know there still are some free thinkers out there.

Weary
2011-04-07, 13:09
I know I'm just a moron f***tard but ...

... the weatherpeople can't even get the weather right for next week. How can they predict 10-20 years from now?

... when I went to school 40 years ago, the scientist were predicting a new ice age. What happened?

... after the 04 hurricanes and Katrina we were supposed to have super hurricanes hitting the USA for the next several years. What happened to them?

... isn't global warming caused by the sun?

... how did we start talking about this?

... if you negatively mention Al Gore on WB, Alligator will delete your post. Can you guess why?
There's no connection between the ability to predict the next week's weather (though I find the predictions are increasingly accurate) and predicting the impact of increasing green house gases on long range temperatures.

I wish the predictions were likely to be wrong. But the evidence sadly points to them being pretty accurate.

I bought two plus acres complete with a ramshackled house 48 years ago for $2,900. The land and rebuilt house fronts on a tidal bay and the Kennebec River estuary.

At a meeting yesterday morning I was told that the latest studies reported two weeks ago predict a minimum sea level rise of three feet within 50 years and as much as six feet within 100 years.

I won't be around in 50 years, but my three kids may be. 70 percent of my land and the basement of my home will be under water if the water level predictions are accurate.

My home and land for all practical purposes represent my entire savings and the entire legacy my kids are likely to receive. The tax assessors place the value at $400,000, which means a half million is probably more accurate.

So I worry. And I don't take much comfort in the skeptics, who argue that thousands of scientists from all over the world who do the actual research are engaged in a giant conspiracy to lie, just to keep the research dollars coming.

And I take even less comfort in those that think there is somehow some connection between the accuracy of their local television weather forecaster and worldwide scientific research on the impacts of growing air pollution.

Gray Blazer
2011-04-07, 13:15
One super volcano and BOOM we're in an ice-age.

sheepdog
2011-04-07, 13:16
So just say you believe in global warming and it is true. Do you honestly think the Chinese, Indians and all these other countries that are just starting to get industrialized are going to do anything about it? Hell no. They are pumping raw sewage and industrial waste in their rivers. They are polluting the air at unprecedented rates. They are living in tin houses and now have a dream of a washing machine and buying a car. They are not going to quit. We are just sending our jobs overseas to countries that have no EPA and don't care.

sheepdog
2011-04-07, 14:57
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Hog On Ice
2011-04-07, 15:06
is that Haley's comma I see there with the big long tail?

Gray Blazer
2011-04-07, 15:09
So just say you believe in global warming and it is true. Do you honestly think the Chinese, Indians and all these other countries that are just starting to get industrialized are going to do anything about it? Hell no. They are pumping raw sewage and industrial waste in their rivers. They are polluting the air at unprecedented rates. They are living in tin houses and now have a dream of a washing machine and buying a car. They are not going to quit. We are just sending our jobs overseas to countries that have no EPA and don't care.

You knocked that one out of the park! :albertein:albertein:albertein

sheepdog
2011-04-07, 15:17
It's kinda like the leashed dog thread on WB. You can complain about the perceived problem all you want to: unless everyone co-operates (and they never do) you are just wasting time.

shadowmoss
2011-04-07, 15:43
I see the effect of no EPA here in Honduras. Exhaust emissions, open burning, poluted ditches that are black as oil (and this is on Post!), haze so thick that I can't see the mountains a few miles away. Trash is everywhere, and people throw it out of the buses going down the road, even to the point of hitting a poor horse pulling his owner and cart full of wood in the face with a bottle. I understand the need for the laws in a way I never would have if I hadn't seen what happens without them.

enviro
2011-04-07, 16:45
save the ales!!

Wack the seals

enviro
2011-04-07, 16:47
It's a shame that resources are dedicated to remove CO2 from emissions when there are plenty of other actually harmful pollutants to tackle.... like the evolving problem of disposing of expired batteries that propel automobiles...nasty stuff there.

I think the real problem is CO and not CO2.

Used tires is another huge solid waste problem.

Nearly Normal
2011-04-07, 18:09
The Farmers Almanac....... All the information most folks need.
Trust me.

Weary
2011-04-07, 18:16
It's a shame that resources are dedicated to remove CO2 from emissions when there are plenty of other actually harmful pollutants to tackle.... like the evolving problem of disposing of expired batteries that propel automobiles...nasty stuff there.
There is a lot of misunderstanding about what is really being done, and what people think is being done. For instance virtually nothing has been done so far to control CO2.

It was only on Jan. 2, this year that the Environmental Protection Agency imposed its first regulations related to greenhouse gas emissions. The immediate effect on utilities, refiners and major manufacturers are small, with the new rules applying only to those planning to build large new facilities or make major modifications to existing plants.

Over the next decade, however, the agency plans to regulate virtually all sources of greenhouse gases, imposing efficiency and emissions requirements on nearly every industry and every region.

There's no practical way to remove CO2, though some attempts have been made to seclude it in underground formations in the few areas where the geology permits. Control of emissions is mostly a matter of requiring maximum efficiency. Electrical power generating facilities are inherently inefficient since typically two thirds or more of the energy in the fuel is lost to the atmosphere or to nearby rivers and ocean waters.

A number of mills in Maine use some of this waste energy as part of their heating or process needs, thus saving them money.

ed bell
2011-04-09, 00:07
I bought two plus acres complete with a ramshackled house 48 years ago for $2,900. The land and rebuilt house fronts on a tidal bay and the Kennebec River estuary.

At a meeting yesterday morning I was told that the latest studies reported two weeks ago predict a minimum sea level rise of three feet within 50 years and as much as six feet within 100 years.

I won't be around in 50 years, but my three kids may be. 70 percent of my land and the basement of my home will be under water if the water level predictions are accurate.

My home and land for all practical purposes represent my entire savings and the entire legacy my kids are likely to receive. The tax assessors place the value at $400,000, which means a half million is probably more accurate.

So I worry. And I don't take much comfort in the skeptics, who argue that thousands of scientists from all over the world who do the actual research are engaged in a giant conspiracy to lie, just to keep the research dollars coming.

And I take even less comfort in those that think there is somehow some connection between the accuracy of their local television weather forecaster and worldwide scientific research on the impacts of growing air pollution.

In all seriousness, and this is out of genuine concern for your worries about this, DO NOT SELL that land. Someone said "the latest studies" predict a sea level rise of a minimum 3 FEET in 50 years and as much as 6 FEET in 100????

Please tell me you are kidding......there is no way that is coming to pass from an increase in CO2 concentrations over that time period.

Please consider the following two posts:

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/01/17/sea-level-may-drop-in-2010/


http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/04/06/whats-delaying-uc-sea-level-data-from-being-updated/

Keep in mind that the current average is 0.4 mm per year (0.0157 inches per year)

There aren't thousands of scientists performing peer reviewed studies that are concluding these bloated sea level rise figures someone fed you....they are a product of projecting ice melt from astronomically inflated predictions of global temperature increases based on models that project temperature increases.....those are based on the unproven and unquantified forcing power of additional CO2 in the atmosphere....none of these are derived from observations, it's all models!!!!!

ed bell
2011-04-09, 00:12
There is a lot of misunderstanding about what is really being done, and what people think is being done. For instance virtually nothing has been done so far to control CO2.

It was only on Jan. 2, this year that the Environmental Protection Agency imposed its first regulations related to greenhouse gas emissions. The immediate effect on utilities, refiners and major manufacturers are small, with the new rules applying only to those planning to build large new facilities or make major modifications to existing plants.

Over the next decade, however, the agency plans to regulate virtually all sources of greenhouse gases, imposing efficiency and emissions requirements on nearly every industry and every region.

There's no practical way to remove CO2, though some attempts have been made to seclude it in underground formations in the few areas where the geology permits. Control of emissions is mostly a matter of requiring maximum efficiency. Electrical power generating facilities are inherently inefficient since typically two thirds or more of the energy in the fuel is lost to the atmosphere or to nearby rivers and ocean waters.

A number of mills in Maine use some of this waste energy as part of their heating or process needs, thus saving them money.

The scary part here is that all this will do is cost consumers more money, hamstring the economy and reward those who plan to profit from this. There will be no change to measurable CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere and no countries will suddenly feel compelled to follow suit. Efficiency is a natural goal of energy providers.....the EPA regulating CO2 emissions isn't going to accelerate that....no way.

JAK
2011-04-10, 10:56
when did Fair and Balanced slip into this?Yeah. I thought they were still out on a hike.

JAK
2011-04-10, 11:04
... the weatherpeople can't even get the weather right for next week. How can they predict 10-20 years from now?
It isn't easy predicting when the weatherman is going to be right, or when the weatherman is going to be wrong. Weatherman prediction is highly complex, and is still an emerging science.

Gray Blazer
2011-04-10, 12:23
You mean someone can predict if the weatherman is going to predict correctly? I think I need my coffee.

Weary
2011-04-10, 12:42
...... the weatherpeople can't even get the weather right for next week. How can they predict 10-20 years from now?

The weather people always get the weather right. When they say it's going to snow, it snows. Rain it rains. High winds, they happen. They are just wrong about where it will happen. Weather patterns across an area are subject to dozens of conflicting pressures. Low pressure areas and high pressure areas pull and push a weather front constantly. I find the predictions increasingly accurate. But they will never be perfect.

Predicting the weather it a bit like predicting the path a chip of wood will take when tossed into a mountain stream. The chip will certainly float downstream. But it will pause when it gets caught behind boulders, skip from side to side as the currents shift.

A weather pattern coming off the Pacific will eventually get to the east, but it's exact path can only be the subject of educated guesses based on past experiences with similar weather fronts.

Scientists more than a century ago figured that the earth's temperatures were higher than they were expected to be, based on their observations of other planets influenced by our sun. They theorized that we were kept unexpectedly warm by the greenhouse gases in our atmosphere. I've not found any serious scientific papers in the century since that seriously disputes this analysis.

It seems logical to me that if some greenhouse gases keep the earth warm, more will make it warmer. So I tend to believe those who think global warming results from the burning of fossil fuels.

But like weather crossing our nation from the Pacific -- and a chip tossed into a mountain stream -- there are a lot of variables that make the warming fluctuate from time to time. Changes in the heat output of the sun. Volcanos that block the sun. Changes in the tilt of the earth. Probably many other influences, some of which may remain to be found.

But I don't find any doubts about the basic pattern of warming when I chat with scientists that have spent much of a lifetime studying the issue.

A year or so ago a scientist, who had spent 35 years studying the issue as part of a team at the University of Maine, spoke at a museum six miles from my home. By happenstance I was with a group that had climbed Katahdin with him when he first arrived in the state in the 1970s.

I was impressed with his knowledge and dedication when we chatted on the summit. I was still impressed when he spoke at the marine museum near my home on what scientists know about global warming. I don't believe he is part of a world wide conspiracy of scientists allegedly lying just to keep research dollars coming.

It's my theory that anyone who climbs Katahdin upon his arrival in Maine, even before he finishes unpacking, is fundamentally wise, honest and knowledgeable.

Kanga
2011-04-10, 13:14
The weather people always get the weather right. When they say it's going to snow, it snows. Rain it rains. High winds, they happen. They are just wrong about where it will happen. Weather patterns across an area are subject to dozens of conflicting pressures. Low pressure areas and high pressure areas pull and push a weather front constantly. I find the predictions increasingly accurate. But they will never be perfect.

Predicting the weather it a bit like predicting the path a chip of wood will take when tossed into a mountain stream. The chip will certainly float downstream. But it will pause when it gets caught behind boulders, skip from side to side as the currents shift.

A weather pattern coming off the Pacific will eventually get to the east, but it's exact path can only be the subject of educated guesses based on past experiences with similar weather fronts.

Scientists more than a century ago figured that the earth's temperatures were higher than they were expected to be, based on their observations of other planets influenced by our sun. They theorized that we were kept unexpectedly warm by the greenhouse gases in our atmosphere. I've not found any serious scientific papers in the century since that seriously disputes this analysis.

It seems logical to me that if some greenhouse gases keep the earth warm, more will make it warmer. So I tend to believe those who think global warming results from the burning of fossil fuels.

But like weather crossing our nation from the Pacific -- and a chip tossed into a mountain stream -- there are a lot of variables that make the warming fluctuate from time to time. Changes in the heat output of the sun. Volcanos that block the sun. Changes in the tilt of the earth. Probably many other influences, some of which may remain to be found.

But I don't find any doubts about the basic pattern of warming when I chat with scientists that have spent much of a lifetime studying the issue.

A year or so ago a scientist, who had spent 35 years studying the issue as part of a team at the University of Maine, spoke at a museum six miles from my home. By happenstance I was with a group that had climbed Katahdin with him when he first arrived in the state in the 1970s.

I was impressed with his knowledge and dedication when we chatted on the summit. I was still impressed when he spoke at the marine museum near my home on what scientists know about global warming. I don't believe he is part of a world wide conspiracy of scientists allegedly lying just to keep research dollars coming.

It's my theory that anyone who climbs Katahdin upon his arrival in Maine, even before he finishes unpacking, is fundamentally wise, honest and knowledgeable.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_bngNvVpYNjI/TE5KD3lytHI/AAAAAAAABDs/8KtyEoksD90/s1600/homer%2520simpson+napping.jpg

Skidsteer
2011-04-10, 16:29
A year or so ago a scientist, who had spent 35 years studying the issue as part of a team at the University of Maine, spoke at a museum six miles from my home. By happenstance I was with a group that had climbed Katahdin with him when he first arrived in the state in the 1970s.

I was impressed with his knowledge and dedication when we chatted on the summit. I was still impressed when he spoke at the marine museum near my home on what scientists know about global warming. I don't believe he is part of a world wide conspiracy of scientists allegedly lying just to keep research dollars coming.

Perhaps you're just easy to bullshit?

ed bell
2011-04-10, 16:49
Perhaps you're just easy to bullshit?If you get very worried when a someone tells you the sea level will rise a minimum of 3 feet in 50 years and at least 6 feet in 100 years according to the "latest studies" when the current observed trend is 0.4 millimeters/year then you definitely are easy to bullshit.....or you're really bad at math.

MonkeyBoy
2011-04-10, 20:56
Cool.......I'll have beachfront property in a few years.

Party at my house!

ed bell
2011-04-10, 21:16
Cool.......I'll have beachfront property in a few years.

Party at my house!What I try to understand is that the sea used to be up as far as Columbia, SC long ago, yet now we think that sea level rises are caused by man? Really?

Kanga
2011-04-10, 21:22
but we're so important..:albertein

Sierra Echo
2011-04-10, 21:23
What I try to understand is that the sea used to be up as far as Columbia, SC long ago, yet now we think that sea level rises are caused by man? Really?

There is a cave in Northern Alabama that has a Megalodon tooth in the ceiling!

sheepdog
2011-04-10, 21:25
I found a shell in my yard.



12 gauge :bike:

Skidsteer
2011-04-10, 22:42
There is a cave in Northern Alabama that has a Megalodon tooth in the ceiling!

There would've been two teeth if the cave was in Georgia.

Sierra Echo
2011-04-10, 22:49
There would've been two teeth if the cave was in Georgia.

LMAO this is true!

Gray Blazer
2011-04-10, 23:24
It's my theory that anyone who climbs Katahdin upon his arrival in Maine, even before he finishes unpacking, is fundamentally wise, honest and knowledgeable.

I've never climbed Katahdin. I'm just a moron.

Weary
2011-04-11, 02:15
Perhaps you're just easy to bullshit?
Well, a lot of people have thought I was pretty gullible from time to time over the years.

Some guy who lived in a tarpaper shack once told me that Maine had preserved 400,000 acres when it sold it's public domain 150 years earlier -- and then forgot what it had done. People laughed and laughed when I wrote a story about the claim for the newspaper where I worked. "Even Maine couldn't forget about 400,000 acres of public land," folks chuckled.

Then some lawyers read the story. Now those lands include the summit ridges of the Mahoosuc Range, Four Ponds, Bigelow, Nahmakanta and scattered other bits of the trail in Maine.

Another time I wrote as if there was a chance that a Republican Maine Legislature would pass the first in the nation comprehensive water cleanup law. Even the director of the Water Improvement Commission laughed at that one. "Bob," he said, "your dreaming. The paper industry will never let this be passed." But pass it did.

I tend to fiollow my instincts about improbable things. Not only did I write about the possibility of cleaning up Maine waters, I invested $2,900 in two acres and a house on a stinking tidal cove of the Kennebec river. The property wasn't a bargain. It had been on the market unsold for six years. But now that the river is a bit cleaner, the tax assessors claim it's worth $400,000.

I won't be around to see if my belief in the scientific evidence about global warming and sea level rise is accurate. But I tend to think the evidence is pretty solid, since about every major scientific organization in the world agrees with me. However, as I said earlier I hope I'm wrong.

Gray Blazer
2011-04-11, 08:13
You said "I" 11 times.

Rockhound
2011-04-11, 09:06
Well, a lot of people have thought I was pretty gullible from time to time over the years.

Some guy who lived in a tarpaper shack once told me that Maine had preserved 400,000 acres when it sold it's public domain 150 years earlier -- and then forgot what it had done. People laughed and laughed when I wrote a story about the claim for the newspaper where I worked. "Even Maine couldn't forget about 400,000 acres of public land," folks chuckled.

Then some lawyers read the story. Now those lands include the summit ridges of the Mahoosuc Range, Four Ponds, Bigelow, Nahmakanta and scattered other bits of the trail in Maine.

Another time I wrote as if there was a chance that a Republican Maine Legislature would pass the first in the nation comprehensive water cleanup law. Even the director of the Water Improvement Commission laughed at that one. "Bob," he said, "your dreaming. The paper industry will never let this be passed." But pass it did.

I tend to fiollow my instincts about improbable things. Not only did I write about the possibility of cleaning up Maine waters, I invested $2,900 in two acres and a house on a stinking tidal cove of the Kennebec river. The property wasn't a bargain. It had been on the market unsold for six years. But now that the river is a bit cleaner, the tax assessors claim it's worth $400,000.

I won't be around to see if my belief in the scientific evidence about global warming and sea level rise is accurate. But I tend the think the evidence is pretty solid, since about every major scientific organization in the world agrees with me. However, as I said earlier I hope I'm wrong.

Some day Weary will have a post with less than 20 words in it.

Austin
2011-04-11, 09:10
Some day Weary will have a post with less than 20 words in it.

Rockhound, You're dreaming.

Russell
2011-04-11, 09:11
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_bngNvVpYNjI/TE5KD3lytHI/AAAAAAAABDs/8KtyEoksD90/s1600/homer%2520simpson+napping.jpg

:cguru:

warraghiyagey
2011-04-11, 09:12
There would've been two teeth if the cave was in Georgia.

:congrats::congrats:

Hog On Ice
2011-04-11, 09:14
Rockhound, You're dreaming.

amazing what those heart meds will do to a head like a rock

Weary
2011-04-11, 10:59
Some day Weary will have a post with less than 20 words in it.
whatever.

Weary
2011-04-11, 11:32
I've never climbed Katahdin. I'm just a moron.
You may be a moron. But not having climbed Katahdin is not necessarily credible evidence.

Tin Man
2011-04-11, 11:50
You may be a moron. But not having climbed Katahdin is not necessarily credible evidence.

and hiking it multiple times does not make one a genius

sheepdog
2011-04-11, 12:41
Some day Weary will have a post with less than 20 words in it.


whatever.

hahahahahahahahhahahaha

Skidsteer
2011-04-11, 18:46
Some day Weary will have a post with less than 20 words in it.


whatever.


hahahahahahahahhahahaha

Yep, that was pretty funny, Weary.