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jamesdinct
2004-03-01, 11:33
looks like it might be the pepsi can one, what do you think?

SGT Rock
2004-03-01, 14:58
Actually it is a design caled The Tuna Can.

Basically you take an empty tuna can - small is prefered, and pour alcohol in it. Use some tent stakes for pot supports and simply light it. A windscreen should probably be used, but you can fold a piece of aluminum foil over to make this.

jamesdinct
2004-03-01, 23:02
cool, what is the scrren/foil for??

SGT Rock
2004-03-02, 02:13
To block the wind and help keep the heat near the pot.

flyfisher
2004-03-03, 15:54
I agree with MSgt Rock's Tuna can. If you want a simple twig burning stove, check this out:

http://www.imrisk.com/woodgas/coffeestove_web.jpg

which I describe here:

http://www.imrisk.com/woodgas/coffeestove.htm

doc
2004-03-03, 16:54
I made the Turbo V8.
I used the spicey hot juice but it did not cook faster.
I use Methyl(HEET) alcohol but it seems to not be efficient.
Took quite a while to boil 3 cups.
My question is if the insulation gets skrunched down will it not wick to the holes properly?
Or are my holes too big?
See the Pics and advise me.
I never did anything like this before and it took me 30 minutes so even this is what I call simple.Barry's Turbo V8 Spicey Stove (http://www.msnusers.com/BarrysPicsfromtheTop/shoebox.msnw?Page=1)

Semper Fi,

Doc

dixicritter
2004-03-03, 17:12
Doc,

I'm not the stove expert around here, but just judging from your photos and what I've seen of SGT Rock's stoves it would appear that the holes are on the large side. Also it seems that the stove itself is much taller than the ones he makes.

I'm sure that when he gets back he'll have a bettter answer for you than this, and much more technical to boot...LOL.

Looks to me like a great first try though. Keep up the good work.

dixi

doc
2004-03-03, 17:50
Thanks Dix

When he gets back? Did he go back to "WORK"?
God love you both, best to all

john pickett
2004-03-03, 22:32
Doc,
Maybe it's the perspective, but it looked to me like you had very little gap between your windscreen and pot walls. I'm no stove expert but I know Sarge recommends a quarter inch gap all the way around. IIRC, he says less gap results in poor performance due to poor air flow. Try a wider gap with foil and see if it helps.
Regards,
John Pickett

doc
2004-03-04, 07:32
After looking at his pics again I realized I pulled the bottom over the top not burner over but in. I fixed that and you are right, I bought a prefab connector section of metal that leaves little room.
I am going to fix that issue. Without the wind screen and redoing the assembly, it worked much better. Thanks, Im hooked, I'll keep playing.

flytier1
2004-04-22, 17:30
Hi All,

The simplest stove is probably buying a Sterno can and dropping a lit match on it after opening :) I personally have been very pleased with the Cobra stove: http://www.boblog.org/at/cobrastove.htm. It is sufficiently easy to make that I do believe that you could make it in the field (you might have to borrow or carry a push pin to make the holes). I have no data, but I suspect that it is more efficient than open stoves similar to a can of sterno. I have my pot only about 1/4 of an inch above the burner (using an Esbit base which I will eventually take a drill to). I also made the center hole a bit bigger than the designer recommends (to facilitate filling).

flytier1
2004-04-22, 18:50
Hi Again,

I forgot one thing. I often want to cook for two, and it helps fuel capacity to invert the concavity of the bottom aluminum can as much as possible. It is easy enough to do a decent job with your fingers.

Mike

Streamweaver
2004-04-22, 19:40
#1 Just buying a can of sterno is not making a stove!

#2 Sterno aint worth crap!!

An altoids can stove is another very easy stove to make and it works well. Streamweaver

Jughead
2004-04-23, 02:35
I bought a stove from http://www.antigravitygear.com (AntiGravity Gear) for about 12 dollars. It works great. I figured I could piddle around and waste my time trying to figure out what works and what doesn't; or I could drop a few dollars and buy one that somebody had already done the legwork on. That way I saved a bunch of trial and error time.

Depends upon how much your free time is worth I guess.

flytier1
2004-04-23, 13:33
Hi,

Apparently humor is not appreciated on this board by some (didn't I even put a smile after my comment?--I did not know that it would be turned into an icon). I was joking about the Sterno can, but frankly the stuff is essentially what is generally burned in all the alcohol stoves (denatured ethanol). If I was still teaching physics, I would have a lab in which some of these stoves were made and tested for efficiency, ease of use, and weight. I recall when working in the catering business, we used to get Sterno (or some clone) in gallon cans. It is an industry standard for chafing dishes. It worked well. I have no idea how the small Sterno cans that one can buy would compare to the various alcohol burning stoves, but until I had seen actual data, I would not discount them out of hand.

Mike

SGT Rock
2004-04-23, 16:35
Naw, we appriciate humor.

As I understand it, Sterno is ethyl alcohol and calcium acetate. I haven't ever tested this stuff against an alcohol stove.

JAK
2004-04-27, 22:46
A hobo stove is pretty easy.
http://journeytoforever.org/edu_hobostove.html

Paint Cans are on the heavy side: (diameter x height)
5 quart= 6-5/8" x 9-1/2" ~ 11.9 oz
1 gallon= 6-5/8" x 7-1/2" = 10.6 oz
half gallon= 5-7/16" x 5-7/8" ~ 7.5 oz
quart= 4-1/4" x 4-7/8" ~ 5.3 oz
pint= 3-7/16" x 3-15/16" ~ 3.7 oz
half pint= 2-7/8" x 2-7/8" ~ 2.7 oz

What about a piece of 6" to 4" tapered stovepipe maybe 12" high such that a tall 4" diameter pot fits down into the top and the hot gas vent out the holes on the far side ?

I read somewhere that wood works better in such a stove as you get radiant heat of the burning wood. What about small stoves that use wood and alcohol or or wood and wax together - for when birch bark and dead-on-the-tree spruce branches are not plentiful?

p.s. potato chips are good substitute for birch bark - but not so much the other way around ;)

flytier1
2004-04-28, 18:15
Hi Sergeant Rock,

Ethyl alcohol and ethanol are synonyms as far as I recall. The only reason that ethanol needs to be adulterated (usually by adding a bit of methanol which is toxic, or more toxic depending on your opinion about drinking :) ) is because of the government. Ethanol which is drinkable is taxed highly.

The large sterno cans that we used often quickly became mostly liquid (I assume the liquid was the usual mixture of ethanol and methanol to stay legal). I often filled the burners for the chafing dishes with mostly liquid. They burned the same, but obviously a spill which could put more fuel out onto whatever table the chafing dish was placed was more likely to cause an uncontrolled fire (hence the utility of the gel). I believe that you have addressed issues of proximity to the flame. Chafing dishes generally left far too much distance from the burner to the dish (for ease of use I would surmise). This led to decreased efficiency and soot problems.

Sgt.Krohn
2004-06-02, 17:54
In Nam we used a B-2unit can(about the size of a cat food or tuna can). We used a "ChurchKey/B-52" can opener and punched 3or4 holes in the sides around the bottom (like the hobo stove) and 3or4 holes in the side around the top.
the Army issued us Trioxane "HeatTabs" - basically blue Sterno tablets that we put in the "stove" and lit. It would do a decent job of boiling a cup or two of water in a canteen cup. ..but it was boring !!!...

The preferred method of boiling water..
We all carried 5#s or more of C-4 plastic explosive. You could tear open a corner of the wrapping and tear off a hunk of the C-4 like putty and lay it on the ground. Stick a match or lighter to it and it burned like a BIG candle. It would boil water in a canteen cup a lot faster than a heat tab in a B-2unit can. ..just call it dual purpose.. :D

In moments of boredom we would tear off a small piece of C-4, light it and then drop a flat rock on it while it burned (DUCK!)
C-4 wont explode unless it has heat & pressure....

Just remember to never stomp out a piece of burning C-4 :rolleyes: :D

Streamweaver
2004-06-02, 18:07
Yeah there was a show on the history channel the other night and they were using c-4 to cook their rations.They were also sticking cans into the vents on the side of a freakin volcano!!LOL They must have had some good timing because I can tell you from experience what happens when a can overheats!!LOL Streamweaver

Streamweaver
2004-06-02, 19:14
Did I say Viet nam??? There you go assuming again! They were showing diferent cooking methods used by GIs throughout history in many locations. Streamweaver

SGT Rock
2004-06-02, 20:46
You can still get C4. I remember using it in Germany in 86 or 87. My PSG was a Vietnam vet, so he just had to show us how to boil water with it.

Sgt.Krohn
2004-06-09, 14:18
I just made one of the "Cobra" versions of the soda can stoves.
Just the bottom of two Coke cans pressed together with holes punched in it with a push-pin thumb tack. It has nothing inside- no fiberglass or perlite.

http://pic12.picturetrail.com/VOL433/1045515/1957272/56222506.jpg

This version of the stove needs to be primed so I used an aluminum cat food can and punched holes in it with a regular hand paper punch. The pot supports are made out of coathanger wire.

http://pic12.picturetrail.com/VOL433/1045515/1957272/56634192.jpg

http://pic12.picturetrail.com/VOL433/1045515/1957272/56634179.jpg

I filled up the little recess on the top of the stove (holds 1/2oz) two times and dribbled a little into the catfood can it's sitting in. From when you light the fumes from the can it takes about 10"-15"seconds for the can to heat up and light the burner holes.

Total weight of the burner, catfood can/pot stand = 1.1oz – with windscreen = 1.5oz.
It takes around 5’min. to boil 16oz. in my aluminum cup without a lid.
(The aluminum cup is from my Gaz Globetrotter butane stove- it holds 20oz to the lip.)
And It will boil a quart in a little over 8’min with 3/4oz of ethanol.
I'm getting about 6’min. burn time on 1/2oz.

I tried to make some windscreens out of Coke & beer cans but the aluminum was the wrong alloy and would just disintegrate. Like others, I ended up making my windscreens out of the cheap aluminum cookie sheets from the grocery store.
The one thing that did work was putting the windscreen together with a regular office stapler.

http://pic12.picturetrail.com/VOL433/1045515/1957272/56666604.jpg

Very efficient! Very light! Very easy to build!

Streamweaver
2004-06-09, 14:33
Sgt Krohn, You prolly already know this but you need to make sure you always plug that center hole before you light the stove or it can explode.Those small foil pie plates (about 3" diam) make good priming plates and are very light. Streamweaver

steve hiker
2004-06-12, 04:19
Originally posted by Sgt.Krohn
We all carried 5#s or more of C-4 plastic explosive. You could tear open a corner of the wrapping and tear off a hunk of the C-4 like putty and lay it on the ground. Stick a match or lighter to it and it burned like a BIG candle. It would boil water in a canteen cup a lot faster than a heat tab in a B-2unit can. ..just call it dual purpose.. :D

In moments of boredom we would tear off a small piece of C-4, light it and then drop a flat rock on it while it burned (DUCK!)
C-4 wont explode unless it has heat & pressure....

Sounds interesting Sgt.Krohn. Wish I had some of that stuff to amuse myself during the hiking off-season (summer).

By the way since you're a Viet vet, what do you think of Nam movies such as Jacob's Ladder, Apocolypse Now, and Beer Hunter (my 3 favorites).

Mutinousdoug
2004-06-12, 15:14
Sgt Krohn fails to note another advantage C4 had over Trioxane heat tabs was the relative lack of noxious fumes produced by the former...4-5 tabs of trioxane lit and thrown into a tunnel or bunker would clear out anyone in there. Similarly, trying to heat a cup of coffee with a heattab in a foxhole on a moonless night with a poncho thrown over yourself and the hole to trap any light would reduce you to a gagging fit and tears. C4, on the other hand, would have your canteen cup boiling before you knew it (a serious violation of light discipline, however).
A word to the wise: don't heat your coffee with heat tabs inside your tent.

Doug

Mutinousdoug
2004-06-14, 17:07
Appears to have been dipped in SOMEthing that burns. I wouldn't be eating no marshmallows off it. Your cat food can looks a little toasted too.
Otherwise, I agree with your premise that plain is better than coated.

Doug

Streamweaver
2004-06-14, 18:04
Alot of people have used coathangers for potstands and I havnt heard of any problems yet ,Any coating on the hangers or cans will burn off with the first couple of burns anyway. Thats a good idea for a pot stand Sgt Krohn! I might have to give that one a try .Streamweaver

Sgt.Krohn
2004-06-14, 18:06
Originally posted by Mutinousdoug
Appears to have been dipped in SOMEthing that burns. I wouldn't be eating no marshmallows off it. Your cat food can looks a little toasted too.
Otherwise, I agree with your premise that plain is better than coated.
Doug
Doug- the coathangers are the cheapies from the cleaners with the white paint. After the paint burns off- all is well.
The catfood can had some kind of a coating on the outside that scortches from the direct heat during the priming process. They, like the coathanger wire just need to be burned in (seasoned) a little.

I tried painting some of the catfood cans and soda can burners with 1200° flat black header paint but the alcohol dissolves the paint- messy.
All of it works best if you just let it burn in.

The stoves just kept getting more efficient the more I tinkered with them. I'm pretty impressed with the version I'm up to now.

flytier1
2004-06-14, 21:03
Sgt. Krohn,

I very much like your pot stand. Kudos for working coat hangers into the design. :) I will have to make one (I am just using my Esbit currently), since when needing to improvise something, I always think of coat hangers. When I made my second Cobra stove, I reversed the concavity in the bottom half (as much as I could with my fingers) to increase the fuel capacity a bit. My Esbit is quite short and the burner can only be 1.5 inches tall (leaving a quarter inch between the burner and the pot). I just discovered 24 ounce beer cans. I bought one, and it fits perfectly in my Esbit. When I get around to it, I will make a Cobra stove with these cans. I estimate that this will increase capacity 15% over the 12 (or 16) ounce can stoves. With a taller pot stand (with easily adjustable height by bending three more coat hanger pieces) I could have even more capacity (I better stop now, because I seem to be having a Tim Taylor moment :) ).

Also, do you actually plug the fill hole? I never have plugged mine. I made my fill hole slightly larger than recommended to speed filling, since I figured that a bit more flame in the center of the pot would likely be efficient enough. Both my Cobra stoves merely burn out. I just partly filled one of the stoves, fired it up, and then waited for it to burn out. I was wondering if I could hear even a small pop, but there was no sound at all.

Sgt.Krohn
2004-06-14, 22:43
Originally posted by flytier1
do you actually plug the fill hole? I never have plugged mine. I made my fill hole slightly larger than recommended to speed filling, since I figured that a bit more flame in the center of the pot would likely be efficient enough.
No I don't plug my fill hole either. I made my hole a little larger by just wallowing the thumb tack in the hole.
The way I think about it- the concave in the top holds roughly 1/2oz and will easily boil 8oz of water. two fills boils 16oz. with about 1'min extra burn after the water boils. I can boil a quart with 3 fills of the concave (my morning coffee). I haven't seen any reason to fill the hole- to increase the pressure? My burner height seems just fine to me. The bottom of my pot is about 1" from the burners vent holes. I think Rock was shooting for 7/8"...

Major Slacker
2004-06-16, 23:18
Sgt. Krohn,

Nice work on the stove and pot stand.

Even lighter and simpler: use the paper punch to make two or three alternating rows of holes just below the rim of the cat food can, add the alcohol, set the pot on the can, light the alcohol with a match through one of the holes.

I've also used the litte pop-top 3 oz. cans of potted meat. (Does anyone actually eat that stuff?)

By the way, how did you do those big and clear photos? I can't seem to get anything but a postage stamp to go through the filter.

Major Slacker

Sgt.Krohn
2004-06-16, 23:58
Originally posted by Major Slacker
Sgt. Krohn, By the way, how did you do those big and clear photos? I can't seem to get anything but a postage stamp to go through the filter.
Major Slacker
MJ-
your can stove reminds me of the cans we punched holes in in Nam for the Trioxane Heat Tabs. On those we needed to punch a row of holes in the side of the can down around the bottom so the heat tabs could get air- then the row around the top for the heat to vent.

I'm a photographer/graphic artist.
I shoot the images with the camera on a tripod with off-camera tungsten lights and the camera's white balance adjustment set to tungsten(3200k).
I resize & prep the photos in Photoshop then I move them up to an online photo album server that allows linking to message boards.
Then I insert the image's URL address into the body of the post with the bulletin board image tags.

skysappr
2004-07-09, 03:06
TOP
Haven't posted in a while, originally I sent you photo's of a Magic Heat stove I had modified. Much to my satisfaction I got a wild hair to build an ION stove for me and my son earlier this week. I have been quite pleased thus far. The bridge between the Magic Heat and ION stoves was a homemade version of the Hike N Light. It was pretty good but I wanted to come down off the weight a bit more from its weight of 2 oz. I also decided to build my own pack which I got the material from Walmart last night. So far short of some final touches of a removable hip belt and an extension collar I am sitting around 14 oz. My current pack is a modified local purchase from the Korean economy in TDC outside Camp Casey. It is around 24 oz possibly a bit more. I basically only weighed the material I removed and did the weight by process of elimination. Hopefully I will have it all done and up and send you some photos when it is done. So far I am pleased, you know what I mean when you have something turn out so well from your own work. My first sewing project where I mainly cut my teeth was on a Gurwell tarp tent. It was another one where I was quite surprised and pleased with the outcome.

More to follow.

SFC Dell FT Irwin

SGT Rock
2004-07-09, 07:39
Cool, I can't wait to see it.

Hog On Ice
2004-07-10, 10:38
what is the most simple stove to make?

looks like it might be the pepsi can one, what do you think?

Well what I use is fairly simple as alcohol stoves go - I just use the aluminum bottom to a tea candle - when filled up with alcohol it is just right for boiling 1.75 cups of water which is what I use for for almost all of my cooked meals. The cooking itself is done in a ziplock in a cozy. The "pot" I use to boil the water in is just a chopped off Heinekin beer can - the 24 ounce "keg" can.

An earlier version of this system can be seen on Stove Stomper's site : link (http://www.datasync.com/~wksmith/hoikit.html) The differences between that and my current setup is that I eliminated the fiberglass out of the burner - it now just an empty cup - this allows me to blow out the stove when I am done and to save any left over alcohol out of the burner for next time. The windscreen I am using now is the side walls from a couple soda cans crimped together and "dovetailed" together at the open edge to make the windscreen for the system - note with this approach one needs to use the windscreen a few times to get the "springyness" of the can side walls to relax (anneal) completely so that the windscreen is basically round when in place.

SGT Rock
2004-07-10, 18:50
HOI sent me one of those to play with in Iraq. They do work. It is still in shipping back from there so I haven't weighed it or tested the performance. But without a doubt it is one of the lightest systems I have ever played with.

Tripps
2004-07-13, 03:26
I agree with Jughead, the alcohol stove at http://www.antigravitygear.com/products/stove.html (http://) is the best way to go. $12, .4 oz, and boils 2 cups of water in 5 minutes on less than 1 ounce of fuel. Mine has worked great for almost a year now. The construction is durable and well thought-out. There are even oz. markers on the inside. Hey, for $12 it's the best stove i've ever owned.

Streamweaver
2004-07-13, 04:00
[QUOTE=Tripps]I agree with Jughead, the alcohol stove at http://www.antigravitygear.com/products/stove.html (http://) is the best way to go. $12, .4 oz, and boils 2 cups of water in 5 minutes on less than 1 ounce of fuel. Mine has worked great for almost a year now. The construction is durable and well thought-out. There are even oz. markers on the inside. Hey, for $12 it's the best stove i've ever owned.[/QUOTE

Your missing an important point, The thread title is "What is the most simple stove to make" not What is the most simple stove to buy. Streamweaver

Tripps
2004-07-13, 04:07
My point is simple: don't waist your time.

Streamweaver
2004-07-13, 04:15
My point is ,some people like making things themselves and dont consider it a waste of time. Streamweaver

Sgt.Krohn
2004-07-13, 13:05
My cat eats a can of food a day and I drink at least two diet Cokes a day- & my wife comes home with at least 3 or 4 coat hangers from the cleaners a week. I'm making 6 or 7 of my catfood can/pot support "Cobra" style burner stoves a week- (see my pix on page 2 of this thread)

I've been giving demos and giving them away to all my friends and neighbors. Everyone has been mesmerized. They can't believe how well the little stove works- boils 16oz in 5min on 3/4oz of alcohol. weighs 1.1oz with the catfood pot stand.

They make a great emergency stove during a power failure- (for normal none hiking people).

I showed them to all my kayak fishing friends and now they're making and carrying them in their yaks for overnight fishing trips.

The one thing I like about Cobra's burner design is it's simplicity. just put the two can halfs together and puch the holes with a pushpin thumbtack.

Redleg
2004-07-17, 16:36
[QUOTE=steve hiker]Sounds interesting Sgt.Krohn. Wish I had some of that stuff to amuse myself during the hiking off-season (summer).

How many grams of c-4 does it take to boil .350 L of water? I rule of thumb denatured alcohal at .5 oz to boil 8 oz. of water at 8,000 ft. Yes the paperwork is a bugger but you can still get licensed for and buy "high energy fuels" in most non california states.

I think that if the trade off is good I may be able to clasify 2 weeks fuel as residue(only for local area though).

Sgt.Krohn
2004-07-17, 17:00
Sounds interesting Sgt.Krohn. Wish I had some of that stuff to amuse myself during the hiking off-season (summer).

How many grams of c-4 does it take to boil .350 L of water?
I don't know how much it weighed? but a glob of C-4 about 2/3 the size of a golf ball would boil half a military canteen cup of water.
We didn't get that scientific about it....

Mutinousdoug
2004-07-17, 23:31
and a glob smaller than a ping pong ball it did it in about 40-50 seconds: Cocoa and Instant coffee or LRRPs (precurser to MREs). Krohn: did you ever get those beans in chili and beans to get soft? EVER? we called them chili and bullets.

Sgt.Krohn
2004-07-18, 13:18
Krohn: did you ever get those beans in chili and beans to get soft? EVER? we called them chili and bullets.
Chili & rocks ;)
they were as hard coming out as they were going in :toilet:

Pencil Pusher
2004-07-24, 16:15
Neat pics and detail of the cat food stove, Krohn. It's cool that everything is homemade and simple. I imagine it made for a neat little project to whittle away some time. Though you maybe won't become a millionaire selling those, I'm sure it'll spark other creative ideas :)